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welcome back everybody uh to episode 102

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of UAP studies podcast I'm Louis Borges

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my good friend and co-host Jason

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gilmette how are you brother I'm very

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good today we have Leslie Keane Arcane I

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should say on the show uh I'm very very

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excited to to talk with her how are you

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doing I'm doing good I'm uh excited when

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you can chat with somebody who's been

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doing this as long as she has female

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which is very rare I mean she's like the

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female George Knapp not to put either of

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them in a box but they I consider them

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an equal Regard in my mind in terms of

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respect absolutely um you know anybody

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associated with the New York Times

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you're vetted and they scrutinize

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everything you do so if you've had any

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kind of career for any length of time

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it's because you know what you're

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talking about and she's written books

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she has you know people I think Michio

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Kaku wrote a glowing review on her

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website I mean her colleagues are like

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the Hal put-offs of the world and Jim

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semivan she knows all the big players uh

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and we're gonna ask her you know like

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where's the new information coming out

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are there going to be some

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whistleblowers what's coming down with

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these Congressional hearings and also

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get her perspective on what the hell is

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actually going on with this stuff is

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this a real thing is this

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interdimensional and all the usual

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questions so it's going to be a great

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show today stick around we'll be right

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[Music]

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all right welcome back to another

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episode of UAP studies podcast this is

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episode 102 Jade we've uh we're we're

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here man we've arrived we've somehow

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made it the 102. I love it yeah we had

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jock Valley episode 100 Ross Colt art

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and we're super excited for 102 and uh

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in fact the next 10 that we have booked

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is going to be very exciting so uh but

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we would be remiss if we didn't include

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a great mind uh in the field and on this

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topic in our discussions uh we have an

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award-winning journalist an author I'll

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read some just a few of her books uh

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UFOs generals pilots and government

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officials go on the record yep that one

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right there surviving death which is

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really interesting it's a journalist

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investigates uh evidence of the

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afterlife and this is all conscious

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based and we are also big fans of that

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type of thinking and want to learn more

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as well uh this lady's colleagues

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include Ralph Blumenthal nichiukaku Jim

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semivan uh I mean her whole damn family

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are basically Congress people I did some

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of research on that too her her

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grandfather her uncle her cousin this is

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a lady that is no stranger to the topic

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of ufology and the world of strangeness

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so we're very excited and we want to

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welcome the show Miss Leslie Kane

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howdy how did you pronounced it right

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you prefer Kane right it's not that I

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prefer that that's the correct

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pronunciation perfect I'm picky with my

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name too my name is Louie spelled with

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an S and I spell it with an E here on

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the show on purpose so people don't call

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me Lewis because it drives me nuts okay

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because I would have thought it was

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Lewis and you would have thought my name

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was King if you read it for sure for

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sure that's why I always tell people

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this pronounced Kane so Leslie Kane uh

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you're a very well known very well

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recognizable I mean I've seen you on TV

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I can't even count how many times uh but

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for anyone who's out there in our viewer

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world who maybe doesn't know who you are

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tell us a little bit about yourself and

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what got you into all this you know the

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world that you're in right now

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okay well I could do that in one minute

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or I could do it in 15 minutes so I

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don't know well we got 45 minutes to an

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hour so you take your time I think most

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people probably know that so I'll keep

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it brief um anyway I'm an investigative

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reporter and um back in 1999 I was

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working at a public radio station in

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California as a producer and a host an

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on-air host for investigative news

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program just doing my job there and then

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I got this somebody a colleague in

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France sent me this report called the

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cometa report which I'm sure today a lot

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of people know about if they're into

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this topic but it was this night it was

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an English translation and no one had

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seen it yet in this country and it was a

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90-page study written by very

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sophisticated people such as a bunch of

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generals an admiral uh the former head

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of the chief of police the former head

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of the equivalent of NASA and France of

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their space agency a bunch of scientists

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and engineers and they spent three years

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looking into UFOs investigate you know

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investigating official cases with great

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data interviewing pilots and these were

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retired people so they weren't actually

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it wasn't a government document it was

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like a white paper that they real put

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together to give to their government

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and I ended up with this English

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translation of that and I was sitting

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there you know just looking at it from a

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journalistic perspective and I was

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absolutely blown away by this report and

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a lot of it was because of the

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conclusion and this was back in 99 you

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know when the taboo was much more

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prevalent and people weren't really very

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outspoken about this topic then and

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these guys said that they thought the

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most rational valid

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um you know the best basically the best

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explanation for the cases they studied

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was the Extraterrestrial hypothesis and

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I had never seen that before

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um and they were basically saying that

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it's likely that we are being visited by

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something extraterrestrial and you know

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I thought this was a huge I was like

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what this is a huge story these guys are

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like generals and Admirals saying this

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um and they went on to explain you know

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why what some of the other possible

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explanations might be and sort of why

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they didn't apply but it was really

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powerful so anyway I just was very taken

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by this and looked into it I started to

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look into a little bit whether you know

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are there and the focus of this report

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was National Security

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so that was sort of the umbrella you

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know it was you it was called UFOs and

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defense what are we prepared for and

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they the purpose they you know they were

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trying to suggest that Pilots should be

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prepared and informed about these

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objects in case they ever encounter one

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we don't want people making stupid

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mistakes to get them in trouble

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so it was defense oriented thing so I

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started to look into a little bit about

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a defense issue you know National

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Security issues in America related to

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UFOs and then I pitched a story to the

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Boston Globe because I was a freelance

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writer at the time and I had published

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numerous articles with the Boston Globe

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on various topics and so the long story

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the short story anyway it was a lot of

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issues with getting it published but in

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May of 2000 uh my first story on UFOs

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came out in the Boston Globe and it

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featured that French report

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and from that moment on I was like so uh

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on fire about this topic and so

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fascinated by it that I basically

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started doing it full time

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and eventually left the radio station

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and have doing it full time pretty much

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ever since I mean I've done other stuff

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too

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but that's how the whole thing started

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and I I was just really uh Blown Away by

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the fact that there wasn't more I mean

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there was a huge response within the UFO

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Community but I thought well you know

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Congress is going to be all over this

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you know the the best investigative

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journalists of the day who work for

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Washington Post or New Yorker or places

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like that are going to be jumping all

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over this and I was you know I didn't

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know yet about how fraught this topic is

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with ridicule and taboo and people don't

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want anything to do with it and they

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think it's baloney and so I just thought

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it was a great story and everybody else

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would too and it was the first step in

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my learning process and it was it was

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partly that

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sort of Silence

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towards the topic that inspired me to

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want to keep going with it and to find

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out what is this all about and then I

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just learned more and more about even

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more evidence and more evidence and more

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evidence and I kept publishing a series

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of stories in the years that followed

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that and got more and more involved

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so that's how it started have you

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noticed a shift at all like within not

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you know before 2017 when you and Ralph

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Blumenthal and um voice freaking her

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name Helen Cooper Alan Cooper uh broke

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the story uh before that you had a lot

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of stigma still in in the 2000s even

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though you had you know come out with

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this amazing book in 2010

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um there's still a lot of stigma about

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this uh this topic have you noticed a

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shift now since the story broke in 2017

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or reporters taking this more seriously

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I know CNN has taken it more seriously

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but here in Canada we have a hard time

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with our media our media does not cover

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it seriously and when they do they say

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on a lighter note which to me always

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pisses me off because it's like how is

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that a lighter note it's probably the

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most important thing this is serious

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business take it that way yeah take it

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that way right

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um we'll say that even after what's

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happened in the last five years they

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still still do that they're always two

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weeks behind so if you know there's

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something they'll be you know they'll

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wait till CNN comes out and you know Fox

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News or whatever the big organizations

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and then two weeks later they'll mention

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it but it's not a big piece it's not

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like top story it's just like on a side

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note with the the puppy that does

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amazing tricks at the end of the show

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you know like on the lighter note so

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they just throw that in there and it

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makes me so mad it's like you're not

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taking this with the severity that it

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merits right but have you on the other

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side of the Border have you noticed a

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shift at all with the reporters or the

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journalists massive shift you know but

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what what you're describing sounds

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exactly like what was happening in

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America prior to 2017. right yeah you

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know it's like and then have I noticed a

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shift huge huge shift since 2017. I mean

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there are still problems but nothing

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like what you're talking about you know

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and after that when the story broke in

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2017 I mean every every media was all

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over it

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every media was going nuts in

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anticipation of the June 2021 report you

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know there was a couple of months prior

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to the release of that report where

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there's like a frenzy in the media in

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America they couldn't get enough of it

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00:10:30,290 --> 00:10:28,740
um and you know then there are lulls and

274
00:10:31,910 --> 00:10:30,300
then something happens you know the

275
00:10:34,070 --> 00:10:31,920
Congressional hearings got a lot of

276
00:10:36,350 --> 00:10:34,080
coverage I mean certainly the

277
00:10:38,090 --> 00:10:36,360
Congressional Hearing in May elevated

278
00:10:39,710 --> 00:10:38,100
the topic even more

279
00:10:41,269 --> 00:10:39,720
you know Congress isn't going to be

280
00:10:44,090 --> 00:10:41,279
holding hearings about something that's

281
00:10:45,710 --> 00:10:44,100
not worth reporting on right right I

282
00:10:48,470 --> 00:10:45,720
don't know I'm just um

283
00:10:49,730 --> 00:10:48,480
it I'm surprised that but you know these

284
00:10:52,009 --> 00:10:49,740
things are happening here they're not

285
00:10:55,490 --> 00:10:52,019
happening in Canada so that's maybe part

286
00:10:57,590 --> 00:10:55,500
of it but I in America yes absolutely a

287
00:11:00,350 --> 00:10:57,600
massive massive shift

288
00:11:02,269 --> 00:11:00,360
um I think it matters too based on sort

289
00:11:04,009 --> 00:11:02,279
of how aware your population is like

290
00:11:06,230 --> 00:11:04,019
Canada has had a few you know shag

291
00:11:08,870 --> 00:11:06,240
Harbor being a big one but I think in

292
00:11:10,550 --> 00:11:08,880
terms of total understanding or total

293
00:11:13,069 --> 00:11:10,560
interest it's a lot less I mean even

294
00:11:14,990 --> 00:11:13,079
this show yeah we are Canadian but the

295
00:11:16,610 --> 00:11:15,000
Canadian Market is like our fourth

296
00:11:17,990 --> 00:11:16,620
biggest audience it's primarily the

297
00:11:20,690 --> 00:11:18,000
United States

298
00:11:22,610 --> 00:11:20,700
um the United Kingdom then Australia and

299
00:11:24,829 --> 00:11:22,620
then Canada so we represent a really

300
00:11:26,870 --> 00:11:24,839
small piece and I don't know if it's

301
00:11:29,329 --> 00:11:26,880
because again the U.S has had so many

302
00:11:31,430 --> 00:11:29,339
you know good authors and well-known

303
00:11:33,769 --> 00:11:31,440
stories Roswell and everything else UK

304
00:11:36,110 --> 00:11:33,779
has had quite a few it just seems to be

305
00:11:38,210 --> 00:11:36,120
more of a paranormal Place Stonehenge

306
00:11:39,769 --> 00:11:38,220
and all that you know like I just think

307
00:11:41,509 --> 00:11:39,779
that we're a little more sleepy and

308
00:11:43,550 --> 00:11:41,519
that's why we're late to the the party

309
00:11:45,710 --> 00:11:43,560
because it's not coming from the people

310
00:11:47,389 --> 00:11:45,720
and credit to the Americans the people

311
00:11:48,889 --> 00:11:47,399
got fired up and said we want to know

312
00:11:50,990 --> 00:11:48,899
more about this and you better start

313
00:11:53,090 --> 00:11:51,000
talking and now there's Congressional

314
00:11:54,590 --> 00:11:53,100
hearing so it's going to come from the

315
00:11:56,030 --> 00:11:54,600
people as what's going to make this

316
00:11:58,130 --> 00:11:56,040
thing really roll

317
00:12:00,230 --> 00:11:58,140
yeah I think that did help a lot um

318
00:12:02,090 --> 00:12:00,240
again we have to I have to I often have

319
00:12:04,069 --> 00:12:02,100
to step back and remind myself that it's

320
00:12:06,530 --> 00:12:04,079
still only a small percentage of people

321
00:12:08,329 --> 00:12:06,540
that really care yeah and don't even

322
00:12:09,949 --> 00:12:08,339
know anything about this and you kind of

323
00:12:11,449 --> 00:12:09,959
forget when you live in this bubble

324
00:12:12,889 --> 00:12:11,459
where you know I'm dealing with all

325
00:12:14,030 --> 00:12:12,899
these people all the time that are so

326
00:12:16,550 --> 00:12:14,040
involved

327
00:12:18,710 --> 00:12:16,560
but um but you know there's definitely

328
00:12:20,269 --> 00:12:18,720
interest I mean in America I think maybe

329
00:12:21,290 --> 00:12:20,279
more than anywhere else I don't know but

330
00:12:23,210 --> 00:12:21,300
definitely

331
00:12:25,790 --> 00:12:23,220
um and you know are there a lot of I

332
00:12:27,710 --> 00:12:25,800
mean it's still tough in the media the

333
00:12:30,889 --> 00:12:27,720
New York Times where I've been reporting

334
00:12:33,110 --> 00:12:30,899
for is a paper that has so much impact

335
00:12:35,509 --> 00:12:33,120
that

336
00:12:36,949 --> 00:12:35,519
um you know it's worth just waiting for

337
00:12:40,730 --> 00:12:36,959
the moment where they will do a story

338
00:12:42,590 --> 00:12:40,740
but very you know it's very very very

339
00:12:44,569 --> 00:12:42,600
difficult to get them to cover things

340
00:12:46,250 --> 00:12:44,579
and and we're not always successful when

341
00:12:48,710 --> 00:12:46,260
we bring a story to them they just don't

342
00:12:52,009 --> 00:12:48,720
think it's important enough so you know

343
00:12:55,009 --> 00:12:52,019
there's still I think a not a lot of

344
00:12:58,009 --> 00:12:55,019
understanding among some media about how

345
00:13:00,889 --> 00:12:58,019
big this story is what it really means

346
00:13:04,190 --> 00:13:00,899
uh and what kind of you know incredible

347
00:13:06,410 --> 00:13:04,200
information there is to justify the

348
00:13:08,150 --> 00:13:06,420
reality of it and the import of it the

349
00:13:10,610 --> 00:13:08,160
importance of it and you know all of

350
00:13:13,129 --> 00:13:10,620
this so we have a ways to go but

351
00:13:17,030 --> 00:13:13,139
there's like a line between

352
00:13:19,430 --> 00:13:17,040
preet 2017 and post 2017. to me that are

353
00:13:21,470 --> 00:13:19,440
like tonight and day yeah

354
00:13:23,030 --> 00:13:21,480
even big name guys like George Knapp

355
00:13:24,590 --> 00:13:23,040
when they were talking about you know

356
00:13:26,750 --> 00:13:24,600
having done a lot of this work right

357
00:13:29,150 --> 00:13:26,760
from the days of mids and Robert Bigelow

358
00:13:31,430 --> 00:13:29,160
and having the information on atip and

359
00:13:32,990 --> 00:13:31,440
ASAP and all the rest and and he

360
00:13:35,030 --> 00:13:33,000
basically said if it didn't go through

361
00:13:36,650 --> 00:13:35,040
someone like Tom DeLonge they weren't

362
00:13:38,210 --> 00:13:36,660
going to publish it they wanted the

363
00:13:40,730 --> 00:13:38,220
notoriety and the clicks and everything

364
00:13:43,490 --> 00:13:40,740
else even though others had done way

365
00:13:45,290 --> 00:13:43,500
more you know influential work uh if it

366
00:13:47,389 --> 00:13:45,300
wasn't for the entertainment aspect or

367
00:13:49,850 --> 00:13:47,399
the sort of media awareness of hey

368
00:13:51,769 --> 00:13:49,860
here's a big name Guy saying this it

369
00:13:53,509 --> 00:13:51,779
kind of gave them that safety net to say

370
00:13:55,190 --> 00:13:53,519
okay well if a celebrity is willing to

371
00:13:57,710 --> 00:13:55,200
go on the record that's a good enough

372
00:13:58,610 --> 00:13:57,720
story in itself we're now not so scared

373
00:14:00,530 --> 00:13:58,620
you know

374
00:14:04,370 --> 00:14:00,540
it's pretty silly given that a celebrity

375
00:14:06,590 --> 00:14:04,380
is just one person yeah else it just has

376
00:14:07,850 --> 00:14:06,600
a job as doing his celebrity thing and

377
00:14:09,889 --> 00:14:07,860
might not know any more than anybody

378
00:14:12,050 --> 00:14:09,899
else and I think I think the key thing

379
00:14:14,269 --> 00:14:12,060
is I mean George has been around for

380
00:14:17,569 --> 00:14:14,279
decades doing incredible work and he had

381
00:14:21,290 --> 00:14:17,579
access to this Las Vegas it's really

382
00:14:22,910 --> 00:14:21,300
good Las Vegas station but I think you

383
00:14:25,190 --> 00:14:22,920
know what my you have to go National

384
00:14:26,930 --> 00:14:25,200
media before if it's really going to

385
00:14:29,810 --> 00:14:26,940
change the Paradigm I think and I think

386
00:14:32,329 --> 00:14:29,820
it was just fell into my lap to get to

387
00:14:34,250 --> 00:14:32,339
do the story for the New York Times and

388
00:14:35,750 --> 00:14:34,260
it was because of the uh you know the

389
00:14:39,110 --> 00:14:35,760
stature of the New York Times that

390
00:14:41,030 --> 00:14:39,120
that's why everything changed yeah so

391
00:14:43,189 --> 00:14:41,040
it's not like there weren't other people

392
00:14:45,230 --> 00:14:43,199
that knew a lot about it already that

393
00:14:47,389 --> 00:14:45,240
that's not the case I'm asking you

394
00:14:48,590 --> 00:14:47,399
understand what I'm saying yeah yeah I

395
00:14:50,810 --> 00:14:48,600
find it interesting you mentioned that

396
00:14:53,930 --> 00:14:50,820
in the late 90s French officials bring

397
00:14:55,490 --> 00:14:53,940
you this report and I I looked into a

398
00:14:57,170 --> 00:14:55,500
little bit myself I'm not an expert or

399
00:14:58,370 --> 00:14:57,180
anything but it seemed like they were

400
00:15:01,009 --> 00:14:58,380
trying to do the same things then that

401
00:15:02,870 --> 00:15:01,019
weren't doing now so a strip away the

402
00:15:04,430 --> 00:15:02,880
stigma a little bit so it can be

403
00:15:07,610 --> 00:15:04,440
something that you know the government

404
00:15:09,530 --> 00:15:07,620
can look at seriously and B investigate

405
00:15:11,750 --> 00:15:09,540
if there is in fact a threat narrative

406
00:15:13,550 --> 00:15:11,760
and that's become a very polarizing

407
00:15:15,829 --> 00:15:13,560
subject is it a threat is it not a

408
00:15:17,810 --> 00:15:15,839
threat and we asked Ross coldheart the

409
00:15:19,610 --> 00:15:17,820
same thing and he said look it's not a

410
00:15:21,769 --> 00:15:19,620
threat in the sense at least in his

411
00:15:23,810 --> 00:15:21,779
opinion he said it's not a threat that

412
00:15:25,670 --> 00:15:23,820
they're going to come take over and it's

413
00:15:27,889 --> 00:15:25,680
a global domination thing or we're going

414
00:15:30,290 --> 00:15:27,899
to be enslaved but if it's something we

415
00:15:32,329 --> 00:15:30,300
don't know and it's in our airspace even

416
00:15:34,910 --> 00:15:32,339
if they're in full control our Pilots

417
00:15:37,550 --> 00:15:34,920
might not be and and that is where the

418
00:15:38,990 --> 00:15:37,560
inherent threat is not but to Jason's

419
00:15:40,850 --> 00:15:39,000
credit he's also chatted with people

420
00:15:42,050 --> 00:15:40,860
that said yeah well if somebody comes

421
00:15:44,090 --> 00:15:42,060
and takes you out of your bedroom and

422
00:15:45,829 --> 00:15:44,100
does whatever they want with you is that

423
00:15:47,810 --> 00:15:45,839
not a threat is that not something we

424
00:15:50,030 --> 00:15:47,820
should be concerned about so highly

425
00:15:51,470 --> 00:15:50,040
illegal thank you for sure yeah what are

426
00:15:54,350 --> 00:15:51,480
your thoughts on the threat narrative

427
00:15:55,790 --> 00:15:54,360
and what kind of threat it's such a

428
00:15:58,250 --> 00:15:55,800
complicated question I mean I would I

429
00:15:59,689 --> 00:15:58,260
would agree with Ross um that in the

430
00:16:01,670 --> 00:15:59,699
bigger picture room it doesn't look like

431
00:16:03,410 --> 00:16:01,680
we're about to be attacked you know

432
00:16:06,170 --> 00:16:03,420
they're not out there shooting down our

433
00:16:07,730 --> 00:16:06,180
aircraft or threatening Us in that sense

434
00:16:09,949 --> 00:16:07,740
but for the for the Department of

435
00:16:12,710 --> 00:16:09,959
Defense anything that can make

436
00:16:14,569 --> 00:16:12,720
incursions into protected airspace and

437
00:16:16,550 --> 00:16:14,579
not identify themselves and Buzz around

438
00:16:19,250 --> 00:16:16,560
Navy ships and do what you know come

439
00:16:21,110 --> 00:16:19,260
close to our our Pilots our Navy Pilots

440
00:16:23,329 --> 00:16:21,120
That's a threat because we don't know

441
00:16:25,310 --> 00:16:23,339
what it is they have they have to frame

442
00:16:27,530 --> 00:16:25,320
it that way and from the very beginning

443
00:16:29,389 --> 00:16:27,540
I remember when I spoke to Luis Elizondo

444
00:16:31,189 --> 00:16:29,399
even before the New York Times story

445
00:16:32,750 --> 00:16:31,199
when I was writing some things for The

446
00:16:35,210 --> 00:16:32,760
Huffington Post I mean he he was very

447
00:16:37,550 --> 00:16:35,220
clear about that it's a Potential Threat

448
00:16:39,889 --> 00:16:37,560
more than a threat and you have to look

449
00:16:43,430 --> 00:16:39,899
at it that way when when it's behaving

450
00:16:45,590 --> 00:16:43,440
the way it is and it also gives them the

451
00:16:47,749 --> 00:16:45,600
then the dod can get involved right

452
00:16:49,910 --> 00:16:47,759
their job is to protect the American

453
00:16:52,670 --> 00:16:49,920
people and to deal with military threats

454
00:16:55,069 --> 00:16:52,680
so it has to go into that boss basket

455
00:16:56,990 --> 00:16:55,079
for them to get involved

456
00:16:58,850 --> 00:16:57,000
um but I would agree I don't see it I

457
00:17:00,410 --> 00:16:58,860
don't I would agree with Ross and I

458
00:17:02,870 --> 00:17:00,420
think for the individual people that

459
00:17:04,610 --> 00:17:02,880
have these terrifying Encounters of

460
00:17:07,549 --> 00:17:04,620
course it's a personal threat for them

461
00:17:10,970 --> 00:17:07,559
absolutely I can understand that

462
00:17:13,789 --> 00:17:10,980
um and that probably makes the whole

463
00:17:15,650 --> 00:17:13,799
thing feel very unthreatening I think I

464
00:17:18,909 --> 00:17:15,660
think Jim semivan might be an example of

465
00:17:21,110 --> 00:17:18,919
somebody who feels this sort of ominous

466
00:17:23,929 --> 00:17:21,120
aspect to it

467
00:17:26,030 --> 00:17:23,939
um you know that there's some non-human

468
00:17:28,490 --> 00:17:26,040
intelligence that has this incredible

469
00:17:30,950 --> 00:17:28,500
power and control and can do basically

470
00:17:34,010 --> 00:17:30,960
anything it wants can control our

471
00:17:35,510 --> 00:17:34,020
thoughts uh can manipulate us we don't

472
00:17:38,090 --> 00:17:35,520
know if it's you know we don't know what

473
00:17:40,850 --> 00:17:38,100
it is where it's from I mean all of that

474
00:17:42,110 --> 00:17:40,860
is you know it depends how you want to

475
00:17:43,490 --> 00:17:42,120
look at it

476
00:17:44,870 --> 00:17:43,500
um and how you Define threat but I can

477
00:17:46,909 --> 00:17:44,880
certainly understand for people who have

478
00:17:49,310 --> 00:17:46,919
had these kinds of encounters

479
00:17:51,110 --> 00:17:49,320
it's frightening therefore it's a threat

480
00:17:53,210 --> 00:17:51,120
and maybe the threat for them is is it

481
00:17:55,909 --> 00:17:53,220
going to happen again to me what's going

482
00:17:57,890 --> 00:17:55,919
to happen next time you know yeah

483
00:18:01,010 --> 00:17:57,900
um so they're all it's very complicated

484
00:18:03,529 --> 00:18:01,020
thing you know but I sort of I like the

485
00:18:06,289 --> 00:18:03,539
idea of Shifting it a bit to the

486
00:18:09,409 --> 00:18:06,299
scientific realm and a bit away from the

487
00:18:11,930 --> 00:18:09,419
military threat realm and kind of try to

488
00:18:13,909 --> 00:18:11,940
balance it out a little bit more

489
00:18:15,890 --> 00:18:13,919
um and I think one way to do that is for

490
00:18:17,390 --> 00:18:15,900
the scientific Community to become more

491
00:18:19,669 --> 00:18:17,400
involved and for us to be able to see it

492
00:18:22,310 --> 00:18:19,679
also as a scientific problem and not

493
00:18:24,890 --> 00:18:22,320
just an intelligence or military problem

494
00:18:28,010 --> 00:18:24,900
right

495
00:18:30,110 --> 00:18:28,020
which yeah and some great organizations

496
00:18:32,930 --> 00:18:30,120
now are starting to come out the Galileo

497
00:18:36,049 --> 00:18:32,940
project the scientific Coalition for uh

498
00:18:37,430 --> 00:18:36,059
UAP studies there's a great people in

499
00:18:39,830 --> 00:18:37,440
science now they're actually taking this

500
00:18:41,630 --> 00:18:39,840
on and you know the stigma seems to be

501
00:18:43,430 --> 00:18:41,640
dying within the community now there

502
00:18:45,470 --> 00:18:43,440
seems to be a lot more people going you

503
00:18:47,029 --> 00:18:45,480
know what I saw something too actually I

504
00:18:49,370 --> 00:18:47,039
should probably look into it and stop

505
00:18:51,529 --> 00:18:49,380
being a hypocrite right uh which is

506
00:18:53,810 --> 00:18:51,539
great I mean it's it's great to see that

507
00:18:56,210 --> 00:18:53,820
within the community as well now one

508
00:18:59,330 --> 00:18:56,220
thing that we covered a lot on the

509
00:19:00,890 --> 00:18:59,340
podcast was the aspect of Consciousness

510
00:19:02,990 --> 00:19:00,900
um because there's always like people

511
00:19:04,430 --> 00:19:03,000
saying oh you know they told me we need

512
00:19:06,110 --> 00:19:04,440
to raise our Consciousness our

513
00:19:07,250 --> 00:19:06,120
Consciousness has a huge thing to play

514
00:19:10,070 --> 00:19:07,260
with

515
00:19:11,570 --> 00:19:10,080
you know um what takes place after a

516
00:19:13,850 --> 00:19:11,580
sighting or anything like that like

517
00:19:16,490 --> 00:19:13,860
there's Consciousness aspects to it you

518
00:19:18,529 --> 00:19:16,500
covered Consciousness in all you know in

519
00:19:21,350 --> 00:19:18,539
your uh documentary

520
00:19:24,049 --> 00:19:21,360
um surviving death and just the fact

521
00:19:25,669 --> 00:19:24,059
that there's Consciousness after we die

522
00:19:28,669 --> 00:19:25,679
sort of like there's got to be a link

523
00:19:30,770 --> 00:19:28,679
there between the two uh between it so

524
00:19:33,409 --> 00:19:30,780
I'm just wondering have you noticed

525
00:19:35,570 --> 00:19:33,419
anything uh you know a link between the

526
00:19:37,909 --> 00:19:35,580
two is there anything similar between

527
00:19:39,490 --> 00:19:37,919
the two that uh you know that you've

528
00:19:41,870 --> 00:19:39,500
found so far

529
00:19:43,430 --> 00:19:41,880
it's such an interesting I mean to me

530
00:19:45,529 --> 00:19:43,440
that's like the most important question

531
00:19:48,169 --> 00:19:45,539
right now right it's the connection

532
00:19:50,930 --> 00:19:48,179
between the world of Consciousness and

533
00:19:52,190 --> 00:19:50,940
the world of the UAP and obviously the

534
00:19:55,190 --> 00:19:52,200
UAP

535
00:19:57,890 --> 00:19:55,200
by definition is so much such a broader

536
00:20:00,049 --> 00:19:57,900
phenomenon than we even than the French

537
00:20:01,730 --> 00:20:00,059
officials saw it in 1999 when they

538
00:20:03,350 --> 00:20:01,740
called the Extraterrestrial hypothesis

539
00:20:05,270 --> 00:20:03,360
it used to be that everybody just

540
00:20:07,010 --> 00:20:05,280
thought oh these are Vis if they're not

541
00:20:09,169 --> 00:20:07,020
from here they're visitors from some

542
00:20:11,210 --> 00:20:09,179
other planet that was you know except

543
00:20:13,909 --> 00:20:11,220
for shock valet who was like at another

544
00:20:16,370 --> 00:20:13,919
level from everybody else and now you

545
00:20:18,830 --> 00:20:16,380
know it's become so clear I think that

546
00:20:20,510 --> 00:20:18,840
this phenomenon is is something way more

547
00:20:23,450 --> 00:20:20,520
complicated and much broader than that

548
00:20:25,190 --> 00:20:23,460
and included in that is the aspect of

549
00:20:27,590 --> 00:20:25,200
Consciousness

550
00:20:29,450 --> 00:20:27,600
um and um you know health effects on

551
00:20:32,270 --> 00:20:29,460
people's psychological effects on people

552
00:20:35,150 --> 00:20:32,280
which are even written into the ndaa

553
00:20:37,190 --> 00:20:35,160
legislation as aspects we need to study

554
00:20:40,010 --> 00:20:37,200
I mean that's how far that has come

555
00:20:41,510 --> 00:20:40,020
right so you know just to tell you guys

556
00:20:43,549 --> 00:20:41,520
that when I wrote my book surviving

557
00:20:46,970 --> 00:20:43,559
death and actually the documentary

558
00:20:49,310 --> 00:20:46,980
series on Netflix wasn't really mine the

559
00:20:51,590 --> 00:20:49,320
book was mine the book was based on my

560
00:20:53,990 --> 00:20:51,600
book but I mean this the series on

561
00:20:56,210 --> 00:20:54,000
Netflix was based on my book but a lot

562
00:20:58,310 --> 00:20:56,220
of it really wasn't based you know was

563
00:21:00,230 --> 00:20:58,320
different than my book and I was a

564
00:21:01,549 --> 00:21:00,240
consultant on that but I wasn't in

565
00:21:02,990 --> 00:21:01,559
charge of that documentary I just want

566
00:21:05,090 --> 00:21:03,000
to make that clear even though I didn't

567
00:21:06,770 --> 00:21:05,100
have control over it yeah yeah but they

568
00:21:08,210 --> 00:21:06,780
did a great job overall I mean I'm

569
00:21:09,770 --> 00:21:08,220
really happy with it I and I'm not

570
00:21:12,169 --> 00:21:09,780
discouraging anybody from watching it I

571
00:21:14,210 --> 00:21:12,179
think it's really great but um so the

572
00:21:17,930 --> 00:21:14,220
you know when I wrote that book it was

573
00:21:19,430 --> 00:21:17,940
like I had absolutely no concept of a

574
00:21:22,370 --> 00:21:19,440
connection between anything that I was

575
00:21:24,169 --> 00:21:22,380
writing in that book and UFOs I thought

576
00:21:27,409 --> 00:21:24,179
of them as completely different topics

577
00:21:29,690 --> 00:21:27,419
and people in my you know in my

578
00:21:31,909 --> 00:21:29,700
and people that I interact with like

579
00:21:33,830 --> 00:21:31,919
Jeff kreibel from Rice University would

580
00:21:35,450 --> 00:21:33,840
say well don't you don't you see that

581
00:21:37,070 --> 00:21:35,460
there's a connection you know or like

582
00:21:39,049 --> 00:21:37,080
you know it just seemed obvious to them

583
00:21:41,510 --> 00:21:39,059
that there was a connection because they

584
00:21:43,250 --> 00:21:41,520
were way ahead of me uh even someone

585
00:21:45,590 --> 00:21:43,260
like Whitley strieber you know and it

586
00:21:47,149 --> 00:21:45,600
was just I couldn't because I had been

587
00:21:49,070 --> 00:21:47,159
so focused on the nuts and bolts

588
00:21:51,350 --> 00:21:49,080
reporting on this topic and really

589
00:21:53,990 --> 00:21:51,360
reporting on it in a way that was trying

590
00:21:55,970 --> 00:21:54,000
to reach you know members of Congress

591
00:21:58,310 --> 00:21:55,980
and policy makers you don't really talk

592
00:22:00,649 --> 00:21:58,320
about Consciousness you don't talk about

593
00:22:02,330 --> 00:22:00,659
weirdness and high strangeness when

594
00:22:04,370 --> 00:22:02,340
you're trying to make a point to policy

595
00:22:05,870 --> 00:22:04,380
makers about hey you guys this stuff is

596
00:22:08,090 --> 00:22:05,880
real you got to pay attention right

597
00:22:11,270 --> 00:22:08,100
right don't want to go into that world

598
00:22:14,450 --> 00:22:11,280
and so I hadn't really gone there and

599
00:22:15,830 --> 00:22:14,460
I thought of my exploration of the you

600
00:22:17,210 --> 00:22:15,840
know the evidence for survival of

601
00:22:20,390 --> 00:22:17,220
Consciousness past death as being a

602
00:22:22,070 --> 00:22:20,400
completely separate topic so I did a lot

603
00:22:24,649 --> 00:22:22,080
of research on that I put it together in

604
00:22:27,409 --> 00:22:24,659
this book and now after the book and it

605
00:22:29,270 --> 00:22:27,419
came out in 2017 ironically you know the

606
00:22:30,350 --> 00:22:29,280
earlier in the same year that the story

607
00:22:33,169 --> 00:22:30,360
came out

608
00:22:35,450 --> 00:22:33,179
and so now I'm really interested in that

609
00:22:37,909 --> 00:22:35,460
connection and I feel like

610
00:22:40,669 --> 00:22:37,919
um I have a lot to learn about it I'm

611
00:22:42,950 --> 00:22:40,679
you know I'm exploring it learning from

612
00:22:44,570 --> 00:22:42,960
other people who like like Jeff

613
00:22:46,430 --> 00:22:44,580
and others who have studied it Diana

614
00:22:49,610 --> 00:22:46,440
pasoka

615
00:22:52,130 --> 00:22:49,620
um and putting it together in my mind in

616
00:22:54,110 --> 00:22:52,140
terms of my own experience and you know

617
00:22:55,909 --> 00:22:54,120
I do recognize that Consciousness plays

618
00:22:58,610 --> 00:22:55,919
a big role you know and every time I

619
00:23:00,409 --> 00:22:58,620
hear something like you know you might

620
00:23:02,390 --> 00:23:00,419
have a multiple witness case for

621
00:23:03,890 --> 00:23:02,400
instance where the witnesses see

622
00:23:06,289 --> 00:23:03,900
different things even though there's

623
00:23:08,330 --> 00:23:06,299
there's a phenomenon there but they see

624
00:23:10,190 --> 00:23:08,340
different things or some of them will

625
00:23:14,390 --> 00:23:10,200
see it and some of them won't

626
00:23:16,070 --> 00:23:14,400
or you know or cases where somebody does

627
00:23:19,010 --> 00:23:16,080
something for no reason they can explain

628
00:23:20,750 --> 00:23:19,020
like they'll go outside in a way that

629
00:23:22,610 --> 00:23:20,760
they would never normally do you know

630
00:23:24,169 --> 00:23:22,620
and then suddenly there's a UFO there I

631
00:23:26,810 --> 00:23:24,179
mean there's there's some kind of

632
00:23:30,110 --> 00:23:26,820
interaction going on between the minds

633
00:23:32,990 --> 00:23:30,120
of the people and the objects and um

634
00:23:36,110 --> 00:23:33,000
also afterwards and I'm sure you know

635
00:23:38,990 --> 00:23:36,120
this is all pretty Elementary but some

636
00:23:41,029 --> 00:23:39,000
some uh Witnesses you know experiencers

637
00:23:43,490 --> 00:23:41,039
have all kinds of effects on their

638
00:23:45,289 --> 00:23:43,500
Consciousness after having an encounter

639
00:23:46,730 --> 00:23:45,299
where they have certain psychic

640
00:23:48,770 --> 00:23:46,740
abilities that open up for them that

641
00:23:50,990 --> 00:23:48,780
they didn't have before you know they

642
00:23:53,630 --> 00:23:51,000
find themselves being more telepathic or

643
00:23:56,570 --> 00:23:53,640
having Clairvoyant abilities or seeing

644
00:23:59,870 --> 00:23:56,580
telekinesis happening around them

645
00:24:02,990 --> 00:23:59,880
um so it affects people's minds and

646
00:24:05,270 --> 00:24:03,000
somehow the minds are engaged with it

647
00:24:08,090 --> 00:24:05,280
and then just to say finally I mean the

648
00:24:10,130 --> 00:24:08,100
whole thing about the afterlife realm if

649
00:24:11,810 --> 00:24:10,140
there is one you know which there's

650
00:24:13,549 --> 00:24:11,820
certainly a lot of evidence to suggest

651
00:24:16,190 --> 00:24:13,559
that there's some kind of

652
00:24:18,470 --> 00:24:16,200
afterlife realm

653
00:24:21,049 --> 00:24:18,480
um maybe the you you know it's an

654
00:24:22,970 --> 00:24:21,059
interdimensional realm and it it seems

655
00:24:25,190 --> 00:24:22,980
that perhaps these some of these UAP

656
00:24:26,210 --> 00:24:25,200
dwell in that same interdimensional

657
00:24:28,310 --> 00:24:26,220
Realm

658
00:24:30,470 --> 00:24:28,320
because sometimes

659
00:24:33,529 --> 00:24:30,480
um witnesses will encounter deceased

660
00:24:36,230 --> 00:24:33,539
people in UFO events and people having

661
00:24:39,470 --> 00:24:36,240
near-death experiences will encounter

662
00:24:41,330 --> 00:24:39,480
what to them appear to be alien people

663
00:24:43,549 --> 00:24:41,340
you know in the classic sort of sense

664
00:24:46,610 --> 00:24:43,559
but there there's overlap in these

665
00:24:49,490 --> 00:24:46,620
encounters between those two worlds

666
00:24:51,049 --> 00:24:49,500
um and I I so there's I I'd love to do

667
00:24:52,730 --> 00:24:51,059
more research and I know there are

668
00:24:55,310 --> 00:24:52,740
people that have done research on those

669
00:24:57,710 --> 00:24:55,320
cases in which there's this intersection

670
00:25:00,289 --> 00:24:57,720
so um you know that's really really

671
00:25:02,510 --> 00:25:00,299
interesting as well so that you know if

672
00:25:04,789 --> 00:25:02,520
they're interdimensional objects of some

673
00:25:07,370 --> 00:25:04,799
sort that can come in and out of our to

674
00:25:09,169 --> 00:25:07,380
our physical space I think a lot of the

675
00:25:12,049 --> 00:25:09,179
phenomena coming from the afterlife

676
00:25:14,270 --> 00:25:12,059
world you know such as Communications or

677
00:25:17,210 --> 00:25:14,280
or effects that one might perceive

678
00:25:19,250 --> 00:25:17,220
coming from a deceased person are also

679
00:25:21,049 --> 00:25:19,260
coming from some other dimension right

680
00:25:23,810 --> 00:25:21,059
so you know there's there's all these

681
00:25:26,390 --> 00:25:23,820
ways to think about it but um and I

682
00:25:28,010 --> 00:25:26,400
think Jacques Vale again has been doing

683
00:25:30,049 --> 00:25:28,020
this for decades and it's kind of been

684
00:25:32,450 --> 00:25:30,059
putting it all into one Universe of

685
00:25:34,190 --> 00:25:32,460
thing and I think more and more people

686
00:25:36,230 --> 00:25:34,200
are now coming around to seeing it that

687
00:25:37,730 --> 00:25:36,240
way but again when you're dealing with

688
00:25:39,950 --> 00:25:37,740
somebody from the Department of Defense

689
00:25:41,750 --> 00:25:39,960
who you know or or a member of Congress

690
00:25:43,850 --> 00:25:41,760
who you're trying to get to take it

691
00:25:46,430 --> 00:25:43,860
seriously that's not the kind of stuff

692
00:25:49,909 --> 00:25:46,440
you talk about even though behind the

693
00:25:52,370 --> 00:25:49,919
scenes of course many of them are aware

694
00:25:54,049 --> 00:25:52,380
of these aspects of it but there is a

695
00:25:57,710 --> 00:25:54,059
conversation that takes place in which

696
00:25:59,330 --> 00:25:57,720
you don't go there yet you know I wonder

697
00:26:01,549 --> 00:25:59,340
how many years it's going to take though

698
00:26:04,310 --> 00:26:01,559
Leslie because you know you bring up the

699
00:26:06,049 --> 00:26:04,320
subject of okay we have visitors

700
00:26:07,970 --> 00:26:06,059
and then you know then we have to look

701
00:26:09,409 --> 00:26:07,980
at the abduction phenomenon the cattle

702
00:26:11,269 --> 00:26:09,419
mutilations

703
00:26:13,549 --> 00:26:11,279
um you know crop circles although we're

704
00:26:15,769 --> 00:26:13,559
not getting too many of those lately but

705
00:26:17,570 --> 00:26:15,779
just a whole phenomenon that takes place

706
00:26:19,430 --> 00:26:17,580
with these sightings

707
00:26:20,990 --> 00:26:19,440
eventually Congress is going to have to

708
00:26:23,870 --> 00:26:21,000
look at that I know that right now it's

709
00:26:25,370 --> 00:26:23,880
just the acceptance of that we're having

710
00:26:26,990 --> 00:26:25,380
some sort of crafts that we don't know

711
00:26:29,450 --> 00:26:27,000
the origins of

712
00:26:31,370 --> 00:26:29,460
accepting that but then the other stuff

713
00:26:32,630 --> 00:26:31,380
is going to eventually trickle down and

714
00:26:35,029 --> 00:26:32,640
they're going to have to look at that as

715
00:26:36,409 --> 00:26:35,039
well but is that going to be years in

716
00:26:38,330 --> 00:26:36,419
the making like are we looking at

717
00:26:40,789 --> 00:26:38,340
another 20 years before we can accept

718
00:26:42,169 --> 00:26:40,799
the whole phenomenon is being actually

719
00:26:44,269 --> 00:26:42,179
happening

720
00:26:45,529 --> 00:26:44,279
I mean I can't imagine it'll take that

721
00:26:47,330 --> 00:26:45,539
long

722
00:26:49,250 --> 00:26:47,340
um because they did you know the fact

723
00:26:52,310 --> 00:26:49,260
that it's in the legislation they say

724
00:26:54,950 --> 00:26:52,320
psychological and health effects now

725
00:26:58,549 --> 00:26:54,960
those those come from these very close

726
00:26:59,990 --> 00:26:58,559
encounter experiences right and um you

727
00:27:02,090 --> 00:27:00,000
know they're they've been studied

728
00:27:04,370 --> 00:27:02,100
extensively by people like kid green and

729
00:27:06,169 --> 00:27:04,380
Gary Nolan and actually the biology of

730
00:27:07,909 --> 00:27:06,179
the impact of some of these encounters

731
00:27:10,130 --> 00:27:07,919
some of them are with high-level

732
00:27:11,870 --> 00:27:10,140
military people so you know they don't

733
00:27:13,310 --> 00:27:11,880
all involve the classic abduction

734
00:27:15,049 --> 00:27:13,320
scenario

735
00:27:18,110 --> 00:27:15,059
but um

736
00:27:20,330 --> 00:27:18,120
I I think I think we will get there I

737
00:27:22,730 --> 00:27:20,340
mean my colleague Ralph Blumenthal did

738
00:27:25,190 --> 00:27:22,740
publish a story about you know in the in

739
00:27:27,890 --> 00:27:25,200
the debrief it wasn't in the New York

740
00:27:29,450 --> 00:27:27,900
Times but um you know for him to write

741
00:27:31,970 --> 00:27:29,460
about this topic and to write the book

742
00:27:33,470 --> 00:27:31,980
about John Mack I think it's helped get

743
00:27:36,890 --> 00:27:33,480
it a little more into the mainstream so

744
00:27:39,409 --> 00:27:36,900
I it's so hard to know I think

745
00:27:41,630 --> 00:27:39,419
I mean there are very credible people

746
00:27:43,789 --> 00:27:41,640
writing and talking in the academic

747
00:27:46,669 --> 00:27:43,799
world about the whole universe of

748
00:27:49,430 --> 00:27:46,679
anomalous experiences which includes the

749
00:27:50,930 --> 00:27:49,440
abduction experience and see putting an

750
00:27:54,110 --> 00:27:50,940
indoor framework which is very

751
00:27:55,789 --> 00:27:54,120
accessible and not too weird you know

752
00:27:57,110 --> 00:27:55,799
and seeing it how it goes back through

753
00:27:59,630 --> 00:27:57,120
time and

754
00:28:01,610 --> 00:27:59,640
a lot of things so I don't know I'm I'm

755
00:28:04,789 --> 00:28:01,620
I'm hoping that

756
00:28:06,890 --> 00:28:04,799
it will because I think that as Jim

757
00:28:08,690 --> 00:28:06,900
semivan has pointed out

758
00:28:10,250 --> 00:28:08,700
these people who are having these

759
00:28:13,010 --> 00:28:10,260
encounters deserve the support and

760
00:28:15,049 --> 00:28:13,020
recognition of the community and of

761
00:28:16,669 --> 00:28:15,059
everyone and they deserve to be able

762
00:28:18,289 --> 00:28:16,679
they deserve the help that they might

763
00:28:20,409 --> 00:28:18,299
need to cope with it and they shouldn't

764
00:28:22,549 --> 00:28:20,419
be stigmatized and ridiculed and

765
00:28:25,430 --> 00:28:22,559
disbelieved I mean it's it's really

766
00:28:26,450 --> 00:28:25,440
really a human rights violation I agree

767
00:28:27,230 --> 00:28:26,460
with that

768
00:28:30,049 --> 00:28:27,240
um

769
00:28:33,110 --> 00:28:30,059
so I'll do everything I can to help move

770
00:28:35,510 --> 00:28:33,120
it forward but um I you know if you do

771
00:28:37,549 --> 00:28:35,520
it too soon it backfires

772
00:28:39,230 --> 00:28:37,559
but of course I'm sure that a lot of

773
00:28:42,049 --> 00:28:39,240
these Congress people

774
00:28:43,789 --> 00:28:42,059
are aware of all of this they're just

775
00:28:45,890 --> 00:28:43,799
not going to put it in legislation or

776
00:28:48,289 --> 00:28:45,900
talk about it but they're aware of a lot

777
00:28:50,330 --> 00:28:48,299
more than we might think and they've had

778
00:28:51,830 --> 00:28:50,340
classified briefings multiple classified

779
00:28:54,230 --> 00:28:51,840
briefings they've talked to lots of

780
00:28:56,690 --> 00:28:54,240
people I mean

781
00:28:58,909 --> 00:28:56,700
you know and people all over the

782
00:29:01,789 --> 00:28:58,919
intelligence Community they know what's

783
00:29:04,070 --> 00:29:01,799
going on so I think it's a matter of

784
00:29:05,870 --> 00:29:04,080
letting it has to unfold somewhat

785
00:29:08,390 --> 00:29:05,880
gradually also

786
00:29:10,549 --> 00:29:08,400
so that we don't shock people aren't

787
00:29:13,610 --> 00:29:10,559
just shocked and panicked and terrified

788
00:29:16,549 --> 00:29:13,620
I'm you know there may be a logic to

789
00:29:17,990 --> 00:29:16,559
letting it unfold and I I think you know

790
00:29:19,549 --> 00:29:18,000
if the next step is for these

791
00:29:22,370 --> 00:29:19,559
whistleblowers to come forward which is

792
00:29:24,409 --> 00:29:22,380
what everybody's anticipating

793
00:29:27,409 --> 00:29:24,419
um and if some of that testimony has to

794
00:29:29,750 --> 00:29:27,419
do with crashed objects

795
00:29:31,549 --> 00:29:29,760
that is a huge step forward and maybe

796
00:29:34,010 --> 00:29:31,559
after that

797
00:29:35,930 --> 00:29:34,020
we can move more into some of these

798
00:29:38,090 --> 00:29:35,940
other things but I don't know I don't

799
00:29:39,529 --> 00:29:38,100
have a crystal ball you know right when

800
00:29:41,990 --> 00:29:39,539
you were mentioning the Consciousness

801
00:29:43,549 --> 00:29:42,000
between people and entities the first

802
00:29:46,669 --> 00:29:43,559
thing that came to mind was the aerial

803
00:29:48,529 --> 00:29:46,679
School phenomenon and mainly because the

804
00:29:50,269 --> 00:29:48,539
kids that like you said some people see

805
00:29:52,430 --> 00:29:50,279
things some people don't some people

806
00:29:54,110 --> 00:29:52,440
will both be in the same encounter but

807
00:29:55,549 --> 00:29:54,120
have a different experience or get a

808
00:29:57,590 --> 00:29:55,559
different message and that's what

809
00:30:00,289 --> 00:29:57,600
happened to the kids some of them got

810
00:30:02,029 --> 00:30:00,299
messages of like you know global warming

811
00:30:04,070 --> 00:30:02,039
and you're destroying your planet other

812
00:30:06,169 --> 00:30:04,080
people got messages of you need to you

813
00:30:08,330 --> 00:30:06,179
know raise your Consciousness and grow

814
00:30:10,130 --> 00:30:08,340
as a species so even though it might

815
00:30:12,529 --> 00:30:10,140
have only been one or two entities with

816
00:30:13,669 --> 00:30:12,539
60 kids or whatever the number was they

817
00:30:15,970 --> 00:30:13,679
all seem to take something different

818
00:30:17,990 --> 00:30:15,980
from that and those creatures

819
00:30:20,330 --> 00:30:18,000
simultaneously communicated with

820
00:30:22,250 --> 00:30:20,340
everybody but the kids didn't feel like

821
00:30:24,409 --> 00:30:22,260
it was a group sighting they felt like

822
00:30:27,529 --> 00:30:24,419
this was a one-on-one that thing talked

823
00:30:29,090 --> 00:30:27,539
to me and told me this and you know and

824
00:30:31,130 --> 00:30:29,100
to your point of people like you know

825
00:30:33,889 --> 00:30:31,140
John Mack and other people that are very

826
00:30:35,990 --> 00:30:33,899
reputed able it took a little bit of of

827
00:30:38,029 --> 00:30:36,000
Risk by getting even involved in that

828
00:30:39,710 --> 00:30:38,039
and Harvard didn't come to his defense

829
00:30:42,049 --> 00:30:39,720
right away like they kind of strung him

830
00:30:43,789 --> 00:30:42,059
out and let him be made a fool before

831
00:30:45,769 --> 00:30:43,799
they finally came and said no no we

832
00:30:48,110 --> 00:30:45,779
respect John Mack and if he wants to

833
00:30:49,610 --> 00:30:48,120
study this then go ahead so it's not

834
00:30:53,029 --> 00:30:49,620
always been an easy thing to get into

835
00:30:54,889 --> 00:30:53,039
and to talk about valet's point of bring

836
00:30:56,810 --> 00:30:54,899
the science everything else will follow

837
00:30:59,149 --> 00:30:56,820
so Jason you said you know how do you

838
00:31:01,669 --> 00:30:59,159
get Congress to take spirituality and

839
00:31:03,830 --> 00:31:01,679
Consciousness seriously when it's even

840
00:31:06,470 --> 00:31:03,840
that much more taboo than flying saucers

841
00:31:08,990 --> 00:31:06,480
well bringing that science if we can get

842
00:31:11,210 --> 00:31:09,000
a little more documentation or a little

843
00:31:12,950 --> 00:31:11,220
more meat that we can then give to them

844
00:31:15,430 --> 00:31:12,960
now they have to look at it because

845
00:31:18,529 --> 00:31:15,440
there's something there so

846
00:31:20,389 --> 00:31:18,539
it's the Pioneers work yeah that's

847
00:31:21,649 --> 00:31:20,399
probably happening already and yeah I

848
00:31:23,810 --> 00:31:21,659
just want to say about the aerial School

849
00:31:25,430 --> 00:31:23,820
event though I agree with you that you

850
00:31:26,510 --> 00:31:25,440
know what you said but I also think on

851
00:31:28,430 --> 00:31:26,520
the flip side of that what's

852
00:31:29,990 --> 00:31:28,440
extraordinary about that case was the

853
00:31:32,570 --> 00:31:30,000
similarity in what all the kids

854
00:31:34,850 --> 00:31:32,580
experience yeah you know that they they

855
00:31:36,289 --> 00:31:34,860
basically all describe basically the

856
00:31:38,630 --> 00:31:36,299
same thing with their little variations

857
00:31:40,010 --> 00:31:38,640
yeah and yeah messages they got but were

858
00:31:42,289 --> 00:31:40,020
somewhat different but they were also

859
00:31:44,029 --> 00:31:42,299
some of them were the same yeah so the

860
00:31:46,490 --> 00:31:44,039
actual event itself is just

861
00:31:48,409 --> 00:31:46,500
extraordinary given the numbers of

862
00:31:50,750 --> 00:31:48,419
witnesses that it had and also the

863
00:31:53,090 --> 00:31:50,760
impact that it's had on those kids as

864
00:31:55,909 --> 00:31:53,100
adults which is portrayed in this new

865
00:31:57,470 --> 00:31:55,919
film by Randy Nickerson yeah we had him

866
00:31:59,269 --> 00:31:57,480
on the show and we asked them about that

867
00:32:01,010 --> 00:31:59,279
and that's basically what he had said

868
00:32:02,990 --> 00:32:01,020
and he mentioned that you know when John

869
00:32:05,510 --> 00:32:03,000
interviewed all the kids if their

870
00:32:06,889 --> 00:32:05,520
stories were all identical then it

871
00:32:08,990 --> 00:32:06,899
wouldn't be good because then that's

872
00:32:10,789 --> 00:32:09,000
proof of collusion or they all you know

873
00:32:13,669 --> 00:32:10,799
told the same story over and over they

874
00:32:15,649 --> 00:32:13,679
all kind of Amalgamated into one but to

875
00:32:18,289 --> 00:32:15,659
have those subtle variances and little

876
00:32:19,909 --> 00:32:18,299
differences that even if kids saw a car

877
00:32:21,350 --> 00:32:19,919
accident they would all have a slightly

878
00:32:23,870 --> 00:32:21,360
different way of telling that story

879
00:32:26,510 --> 00:32:23,880
because they're so young so that was

880
00:32:28,669 --> 00:32:26,520
also present in their recounting of this

881
00:32:30,529 --> 00:32:28,679
experience so that's what John really

882
00:32:32,690 --> 00:32:30,539
went off of it was no no it wasn't just

883
00:32:34,850 --> 00:32:32,700
what the kids were saying saying was how

884
00:32:36,649 --> 00:32:34,860
they said it it was very natural and it

885
00:32:39,169 --> 00:32:36,659
was it was very believable you know

886
00:32:40,730 --> 00:32:39,179
right with a lot of emotion too yeah and

887
00:32:42,230 --> 00:32:40,740
even to this day like the people that

888
00:32:44,090 --> 00:32:42,240
were in the movie they they got

889
00:32:47,029 --> 00:32:44,100
emotional when they went back to the Rua

890
00:32:48,529 --> 00:32:47,039
Zimbabwe aerial school and you know they

891
00:32:50,690 --> 00:32:48,539
uh I don't know if it was because that

892
00:32:52,490 --> 00:32:50,700
they were believed if it was like you're

893
00:32:54,110 --> 00:32:52,500
supposed to be proper here we don't talk

894
00:32:55,730 --> 00:32:54,120
about those things or you know maybe

895
00:32:58,010 --> 00:32:55,740
they had fundamentalist religious

896
00:32:59,690 --> 00:32:58,020
parents but whatever there was a lot of

897
00:33:02,510 --> 00:32:59,700
trauma it wasn't like the aliens

898
00:33:04,430 --> 00:33:02,520
traumatized them but the experience and

899
00:33:06,230 --> 00:33:04,440
the aftermath really traumatized them

900
00:33:08,149 --> 00:33:06,240
and not being believed you know I'm sure

901
00:33:09,769 --> 00:33:08,159
they were all told that you didn't see

902
00:33:11,389 --> 00:33:09,779
that stop talking about

903
00:33:12,830 --> 00:33:11,399
yeah a lot of them were I don't think

904
00:33:14,389 --> 00:33:12,840
all of them were but the ones that were

905
00:33:17,090 --> 00:33:14,399
of course it was much harder for them

906
00:33:19,070 --> 00:33:17,100
really hard yeah yeah so it's a really

907
00:33:21,529 --> 00:33:19,080
really powerful case and that's a very

908
00:33:23,029 --> 00:33:21,539
one of the best cases I think for you

909
00:33:24,289 --> 00:33:23,039
know evidence for this close encounter

910
00:33:26,210 --> 00:33:24,299
kind of experience where there are

911
00:33:29,090 --> 00:33:26,220
actual beings involved

912
00:33:31,490 --> 00:33:29,100
so you know yeah it's all that stuff is

913
00:33:33,470 --> 00:33:31,500
so so important and there's been a few

914
00:33:34,730 --> 00:33:33,480
it's not the only School sighting I know

915
00:33:37,909 --> 00:33:34,740
there was one in England and I think

916
00:33:41,090 --> 00:33:37,919
Australia as well oh yeah so yeah it's

917
00:33:42,730 --> 00:33:41,100
bizarre you know but it happens it's

918
00:33:44,870 --> 00:33:42,740
like they sense that there's a

919
00:33:47,509 --> 00:33:44,880
vulnerability there and like a clean

920
00:33:48,950 --> 00:33:47,519
palette if we can get a message out well

921
00:33:50,930 --> 00:33:48,960
to hell with the old ones they're

922
00:33:52,970 --> 00:33:50,940
already so far gone maybe they start

923
00:33:54,350 --> 00:33:52,980
with the younger Generations that we

924
00:33:56,450 --> 00:33:54,360
have a shot of getting through to them

925
00:33:58,490 --> 00:33:56,460
if the kids will tell them I don't know

926
00:34:01,009 --> 00:33:58,500
could be I don't know I mean they

927
00:34:02,990 --> 00:34:01,019
probably I don't know but it happens and

928
00:34:04,730 --> 00:34:03,000
it's very powerful what those those kids

929
00:34:06,830 --> 00:34:04,740
are unbelievable yeah they're so

930
00:34:08,750 --> 00:34:06,840
believable they're unbelievable in how

931
00:34:10,490 --> 00:34:08,760
believable they are yeah exactly yeah

932
00:34:13,430 --> 00:34:10,500
and you can see it in their faces like

933
00:34:16,070 --> 00:34:13,440
they seen something I can't get my kids

934
00:34:18,349 --> 00:34:16,080
to correlate a lie together to tell me

935
00:34:19,970 --> 00:34:18,359
who left their cup out in the living

936
00:34:22,430 --> 00:34:19,980
room they can't even you know they can't

937
00:34:24,829 --> 00:34:22,440
even lie together so I get much less a

938
00:34:26,389 --> 00:34:24,839
school of how many kids saw it like 60

939
00:34:27,349 --> 00:34:26,399
kids something new or something like

940
00:34:31,250 --> 00:34:27,359
that yeah

941
00:34:33,530 --> 00:34:31,260
um you can't more yeah it's crazy

942
00:34:34,849 --> 00:34:33,540
um as far as the whistle younger ones

943
00:34:37,010 --> 00:34:34,859
which weren't included in the film

944
00:34:38,750 --> 00:34:37,020
that's right yeah yeah and they tend not

945
00:34:39,829 --> 00:34:38,760
to be as affected as the older ones I

946
00:34:42,109 --> 00:34:39,839
guess the older ones were really

947
00:34:44,389 --> 00:34:42,119
affected by it maybe the younger ones

948
00:34:45,770 --> 00:34:44,399
were just too little to deal with you

949
00:34:48,290 --> 00:34:45,780
know to get it they were like first

950
00:34:49,849 --> 00:34:48,300
graders or something right they were

951
00:34:52,430 --> 00:34:49,859
really even interviewed that much much

952
00:34:55,369 --> 00:34:52,440
but you know there were a lot of them a

953
00:34:57,770 --> 00:34:55,379
lot of kids yeah so we're looking

954
00:34:59,750 --> 00:34:57,780
forward to whistleblowers coming out in

955
00:35:01,550 --> 00:34:59,760
Ford do you think we're heading towards

956
00:35:03,829 --> 00:35:01,560
kind of like um

957
00:35:06,530 --> 00:35:03,839
I keep mentioning this like a me too of

958
00:35:09,170 --> 00:35:06,540
UFOs like witnesses that are going to

959
00:35:12,530 --> 00:35:09,180
come out and you know say hey I've had

960
00:35:14,870 --> 00:35:12,540
an experience here as well are we

961
00:35:16,670 --> 00:35:14,880
are we potentially looking at that or is

962
00:35:18,170 --> 00:35:16,680
it still going to be hard for us to get

963
00:35:20,150 --> 00:35:18,180
whistleblowers to come out especially

964
00:35:21,589 --> 00:35:20,160
with what is going on on your side of

965
00:35:23,810 --> 00:35:21,599
the border right now

966
00:35:25,250 --> 00:35:23,820
yeah I mean it's hard to say how it's

967
00:35:27,589 --> 00:35:25,260
going to happen I I think the

968
00:35:29,630 --> 00:35:27,599
legislation is going to pass that will

969
00:35:32,210 --> 00:35:29,640
give them the protections to do this

970
00:35:34,010 --> 00:35:32,220
right right then they will have to go in

971
00:35:36,170 --> 00:35:34,020
private sessions with with the the

972
00:35:38,329 --> 00:35:36,180
appropriate members of Congress to kind

973
00:35:40,190 --> 00:35:38,339
of screen what they want to say because

974
00:35:42,890 --> 00:35:40,200
they still have to be careful about the

975
00:35:44,569 --> 00:35:42,900
National Security aspects there are

976
00:35:47,170 --> 00:35:44,579
still things that they do not want our

977
00:35:49,990 --> 00:35:47,180
adversaries to have access to

978
00:35:52,130 --> 00:35:50,000
understandably so and so you know

979
00:35:54,290 --> 00:35:52,140
they'll have to go through a screening

980
00:35:56,390 --> 00:35:54,300
process with Congress then it's a

981
00:35:59,150 --> 00:35:56,400
question of whether how much or whether

982
00:36:00,290 --> 00:35:59,160
it'll be made public or not it'll take a

983
00:36:03,970 --> 00:36:00,300
while

984
00:36:06,890 --> 00:36:03,980
um there might be leaks who knows uh

985
00:36:09,170 --> 00:36:06,900
so um I forget what your question was

986
00:36:11,870 --> 00:36:09,180
but the question was is that likely to

987
00:36:13,550 --> 00:36:11,880
happen I forget yeah are we looking at a

988
00:36:16,190 --> 00:36:13,560
kind of a movement of whistleblowers

989
00:36:18,050 --> 00:36:16,200
after this goes through I mean there are

990
00:36:20,150 --> 00:36:18,060
a lot there are plenty of them waiting

991
00:36:21,890 --> 00:36:20,160
in the wings I do know that and it's

992
00:36:23,450 --> 00:36:21,900
just I think it also depends on whether

993
00:36:25,670 --> 00:36:23,460
there are factions

994
00:36:28,250 --> 00:36:25,680
out there who don't want this to happen

995
00:36:30,829 --> 00:36:28,260
right and whether they will have any

996
00:36:32,990 --> 00:36:30,839
success in slowing it down or you know

997
00:36:34,849 --> 00:36:33,000
keeping certain Witnesses out of the

998
00:36:37,970 --> 00:36:34,859
picture and bring maybe they'll only

999
00:36:41,030 --> 00:36:37,980
bring in ones that are you know less

1000
00:36:43,010 --> 00:36:41,040
controversial and maybe some Navy pilots

1001
00:36:44,870 --> 00:36:43,020
who can talk about a sighting as opposed

1002
00:36:47,050 --> 00:36:44,880
to somebody talking about a black

1003
00:36:49,670 --> 00:36:47,060
program where they worked on a crash

1004
00:36:52,010 --> 00:36:49,680
object you know we just don't know I

1005
00:36:54,470 --> 00:36:52,020
mean I think there's a lot of um

1006
00:36:56,150 --> 00:36:54,480
differing perspectives behind the scenes

1007
00:36:57,650 --> 00:36:56,160
of what should and shouldn't happen and

1008
00:36:59,750 --> 00:36:57,660
how quickly it should happen and all

1009
00:37:03,410 --> 00:36:59,760
that but it seems that the members of

1010
00:37:05,030 --> 00:37:03,420
Congress are you know on track to move

1011
00:37:07,609 --> 00:37:05,040
this thing forward and they're they're

1012
00:37:10,550 --> 00:37:07,619
setting up legislation make it possible

1013
00:37:12,470 --> 00:37:10,560
so I suspect it a lot it will happen in

1014
00:37:14,630 --> 00:37:12,480
the next year or two on that you know on

1015
00:37:16,130 --> 00:37:14,640
that level but you know I have no more

1016
00:37:18,710 --> 00:37:16,140
insight into the future than anybody

1017
00:37:20,510 --> 00:37:18,720
else I just talk to people and

1018
00:37:21,890 --> 00:37:20,520
hear from hear what they have to say and

1019
00:37:24,910 --> 00:37:21,900
then you know things are lining up for

1020
00:37:27,770 --> 00:37:24,920
that to happen that's for sure yeah yeah

1021
00:37:29,510 --> 00:37:27,780
last week and he basically said that a

1022
00:37:31,310 --> 00:37:29,520
lot of this infighting and stone

1023
00:37:33,890 --> 00:37:31,320
throwing that happens in social media

1024
00:37:35,750 --> 00:37:33,900
that if we get too carried away with

1025
00:37:37,609 --> 00:37:35,760
that we can prevent this thing from

1026
00:37:39,410 --> 00:37:37,619
rolling out because the people who were

1027
00:37:41,990 --> 00:37:39,420
once willing to give us their

1028
00:37:43,910 --> 00:37:42,000
information they might just say screw it

1029
00:37:46,370 --> 00:37:43,920
I saw what you did to Lou Elizondo and a

1030
00:37:49,370 --> 00:37:46,380
few other guys I'm good like they don't

1031
00:37:51,890 --> 00:37:49,380
need the hassle so if if it's not an

1032
00:37:54,410 --> 00:37:51,900
open and welcoming environment to some

1033
00:37:56,089 --> 00:37:54,420
respect uh we run the risk of losing

1034
00:37:57,890 --> 00:37:56,099
some of these people's testimony because

1035
00:38:00,290 --> 00:37:57,900
they just don't want to get you know

1036
00:38:02,150 --> 00:38:00,300
either they don't want to be the victim

1037
00:38:04,069 --> 00:38:02,160
of that type of shelling or they just

1038
00:38:06,290 --> 00:38:04,079
again we're getting more taboo with the

1039
00:38:08,089 --> 00:38:06,300
subject and all the work to remove those

1040
00:38:09,950 --> 00:38:08,099
layers is kind of going down the drain

1041
00:38:11,510 --> 00:38:09,960
because it's becoming a bunch of idiots

1042
00:38:14,030 --> 00:38:11,520
just fighting amongst themselves you

1043
00:38:16,849 --> 00:38:14,040
know and the social media World anyways

1044
00:38:19,310 --> 00:38:16,859
yeah I mean I I don't even go on I don't

1045
00:38:21,829 --> 00:38:19,320
even go on Twitter hardly ever so

1046
00:38:23,150 --> 00:38:21,839
fortunately I'm not exposed to all of

1047
00:38:25,010 --> 00:38:23,160
that I just hear about it from other

1048
00:38:27,170 --> 00:38:25,020
people but it doesn't sound like it's a

1049
00:38:29,030 --> 00:38:27,180
very healthy healthy thing and yeah

1050
00:38:30,710 --> 00:38:29,040
obviously if they want I mean obviously

1051
00:38:32,750 --> 00:38:30,720
these are people who probably don't want

1052
00:38:34,910 --> 00:38:32,760
witnesses to come forward maybe that's

1053
00:38:37,849 --> 00:38:34,920
why they're doing this I don't know but

1054
00:38:40,130 --> 00:38:37,859
I hope that they are just not important

1055
00:38:41,270 --> 00:38:40,140
enough really which I personally don't

1056
00:38:43,609 --> 00:38:41,280
think they are

1057
00:38:46,130 --> 00:38:43,619
to have such an impact as to actually

1058
00:38:47,750 --> 00:38:46,140
keep somebody from coming forward and I

1059
00:38:51,010 --> 00:38:47,760
just hope that these people out there

1060
00:38:53,210 --> 00:38:51,020
just don't bother reading all that stuff

1061
00:38:55,490 --> 00:38:53,220
unfortunately it's hard not to I know

1062
00:38:57,890 --> 00:38:55,500
that definitely Lou Elizondo was deeply

1063
00:38:59,569 --> 00:38:57,900
affected by it and you know I am I know

1064
00:39:02,270 --> 00:38:59,579
that for a fact so

1065
00:39:04,670 --> 00:39:02,280
yeah it's a problem I I hope that people

1066
00:39:06,470 --> 00:39:04,680
will tone it down in that on that level

1067
00:39:07,490 --> 00:39:06,480
I agree with Ross it's definitely a

1068
00:39:10,849 --> 00:39:07,500
problem

1069
00:39:13,970 --> 00:39:10,859
um so I think that and I think for

1070
00:39:16,130 --> 00:39:13,980
scientists too because I think the

1071
00:39:17,810 --> 00:39:16,140
stigma is deepest within this it's

1072
00:39:19,490 --> 00:39:17,820
deeper in the scientific world than it

1073
00:39:20,870 --> 00:39:19,500
is with the military community at this

1074
00:39:23,150 --> 00:39:20,880
point I mean that they've sort of been

1075
00:39:24,530 --> 00:39:23,160
the last people to come around and I

1076
00:39:26,569 --> 00:39:24,540
still think

1077
00:39:29,329 --> 00:39:26,579
to get more scientists to come forward

1078
00:39:31,490 --> 00:39:29,339
you know you don't want to be creating

1079
00:39:34,270 --> 00:39:31,500
ridicule problems for them obviously

1080
00:39:37,910 --> 00:39:36,530
and you know everything that goes behind

1081
00:39:40,370 --> 00:39:37,920
their papers is all about their

1082
00:39:42,050 --> 00:39:40,380
reputation they don't want to even if

1083
00:39:43,849 --> 00:39:42,060
there's a small chance that that could

1084
00:39:45,470 --> 00:39:43,859
happen a lot of these guys will say

1085
00:39:48,050 --> 00:39:45,480
forget it I mean not everyone has that

1086
00:39:49,910 --> 00:39:48,060
fortitude of Jacques valet to say I know

1087
00:39:52,190 --> 00:39:49,920
what I know and you can't tear me down

1088
00:39:54,829 --> 00:39:52,200
but he's an anomaly right A lot of these

1089
00:39:57,170 --> 00:39:54,839
other people they are their name their

1090
00:39:58,849 --> 00:39:57,180
entire book of work is their name and

1091
00:40:01,430 --> 00:39:58,859
they don't want that tarnish or even

1092
00:40:03,950 --> 00:40:01,440
just something could happen Gary Nolan's

1093
00:40:06,290 --> 00:40:03,960
another example of somebody extremely

1094
00:40:09,170 --> 00:40:06,300
successful who is just as I don't care

1095
00:40:11,210 --> 00:40:09,180
I'm just dealing with data yeah whole P

1096
00:40:13,250 --> 00:40:11,220
I don't care what people say and you

1097
00:40:15,349 --> 00:40:13,260
know that's what you've got to do I mean

1098
00:40:17,390 --> 00:40:15,359
I think the important thing is just not

1099
00:40:18,890 --> 00:40:17,400
to engage with Twitter why even go on

1100
00:40:21,589 --> 00:40:18,900
and read all this stuff

1101
00:40:24,050 --> 00:40:21,599
yeah what what the point is

1102
00:40:25,130 --> 00:40:24,060
um that's a good point I don't even go

1103
00:40:28,250 --> 00:40:25,140
on there

1104
00:40:30,829 --> 00:40:28,260
uh but I hope that fewer and fewer

1105
00:40:33,410 --> 00:40:30,839
people do that if you don't engage with

1106
00:40:35,030 --> 00:40:33,420
it then what what Joy are these people

1107
00:40:38,030 --> 00:40:35,040
going to get out of doing what they do

1108
00:40:39,950 --> 00:40:38,040
maybe they'll just if you ignore them I

1109
00:40:42,349 --> 00:40:39,960
don't know I'm not part of the you that

1110
00:40:45,710 --> 00:40:42,359
Universal I don't know how really

1111
00:40:47,990 --> 00:40:45,720
um but yeah I mean I think as long as

1112
00:40:49,670 --> 00:40:48,000
you're a scientist with data then you

1113
00:40:52,310 --> 00:40:49,680
should you should be fine

1114
00:40:54,470 --> 00:40:52,320
and look Gary Nolan and look at Avi love

1115
00:40:56,750 --> 00:40:54,480
as as two shining lights who hopefully

1116
00:40:58,730 --> 00:40:56,760
will encourage other scientists to come

1117
00:41:00,829 --> 00:40:58,740
forward yeah

1118
00:41:03,650 --> 00:41:00,839
what what advice could you give people

1119
00:41:06,710 --> 00:41:03,660
that want to investigate this on a

1120
00:41:08,030 --> 00:41:06,720
journalistic approach because there's a

1121
00:41:10,310 --> 00:41:08,040
lot of people that may be listening to

1122
00:41:12,050 --> 00:41:10,320
this that want to contribute to

1123
00:41:14,450 --> 00:41:12,060
um you know the whole movement of

1124
00:41:16,609 --> 00:41:14,460
ufology or disclosure they might write

1125
00:41:18,950 --> 00:41:16,619
blogs and and you know have different

1126
00:41:23,150 --> 00:41:18,960
Medias what advice would you give people

1127
00:41:25,310 --> 00:41:23,160
when they're researching uh this subject

1128
00:41:27,470 --> 00:41:25,320
when they're I mean and how to research

1129
00:41:29,089 --> 00:41:27,480
it or yeah just just how to research or

1130
00:41:31,250 --> 00:41:29,099
how to approach it

1131
00:41:33,530 --> 00:41:31,260
um because we don't have enough people

1132
00:41:36,410 --> 00:41:33,540
teaching us how to do that I fall for

1133
00:41:38,390 --> 00:41:36,420
stuff all the time uh fake stuff and um

1134
00:41:41,030 --> 00:41:38,400
I've learned to really you know take my

1135
00:41:43,010 --> 00:41:41,040
time with it analyze it make sure I

1136
00:41:44,329 --> 00:41:43,020
don't fall for it first and foremost

1137
00:41:46,130 --> 00:41:44,339
like I used to

1138
00:41:48,650 --> 00:41:46,140
um I'd like to say I used to I still

1139
00:41:51,770 --> 00:41:48,660
Fall For Stuff uh what advice could you

1140
00:41:53,990 --> 00:41:51,780
give us um just on how to

1141
00:41:56,569 --> 00:41:54,000
Broach a subject or research a subject

1142
00:41:59,450 --> 00:41:56,579
without falling into these traps

1143
00:42:01,370 --> 00:41:59,460
well I would say first of all make sure

1144
00:42:02,630 --> 00:42:01,380
it's corrupt whatever the information is

1145
00:42:04,609 --> 00:42:02,640
that you're concerned about make sure

1146
00:42:07,130 --> 00:42:04,619
you you know you can get it corroborated

1147
00:42:09,589 --> 00:42:07,140
but there's evidence to back it up if

1148
00:42:11,270 --> 00:42:09,599
it's just a claim

1149
00:42:14,150 --> 00:42:11,280
um and and I've dealt with this my you

1150
00:42:17,329 --> 00:42:14,160
know since for 22 years if it's just a

1151
00:42:19,609 --> 00:42:17,339
claim it might be true but if it's just

1152
00:42:23,210 --> 00:42:19,619
a claim don't write about it because

1153
00:42:25,730 --> 00:42:23,220
there's no way that you can verify it

1154
00:42:28,250 --> 00:42:25,740
there's no corroboration there's nobody

1155
00:42:30,589 --> 00:42:28,260
to stand up and you know you I mean it's

1156
00:42:32,690 --> 00:42:30,599
through journalism you have to have more

1157
00:42:35,329 --> 00:42:32,700
than one source for a story

1158
00:42:36,890 --> 00:42:35,339
you've got to have documents or multiple

1159
00:42:38,089 --> 00:42:36,900
sources and they've got to be very

1160
00:42:41,569 --> 00:42:38,099
credible

1161
00:42:44,510 --> 00:42:41,579
so if somebody just has a claim you know

1162
00:42:46,490 --> 00:42:44,520
and you can't verify it and there are so

1163
00:42:48,650 --> 00:42:46,500
many interesting claims out there but if

1164
00:42:51,589 --> 00:42:48,660
it can't be verified

1165
00:42:53,870 --> 00:42:51,599
like for me I just don't even hardly

1166
00:42:57,349 --> 00:42:53,880
look into something that doesn't have

1167
00:42:59,390 --> 00:42:57,359
that solid base in fact and in terms of

1168
00:43:00,890 --> 00:42:59,400
the I mean it's not so much whether it's

1169
00:43:04,609 --> 00:43:00,900
a fact or not it's whether whether it

1170
00:43:08,089 --> 00:43:04,619
can be backed up and substantiated right

1171
00:43:10,250 --> 00:43:08,099
um and even if it's true and enticing

1172
00:43:12,470 --> 00:43:10,260
and fascinating you just can't put it

1173
00:43:15,230 --> 00:43:12,480
out there unless it has that you know

1174
00:43:17,150 --> 00:43:15,240
and you might try to find it if

1175
00:43:18,890 --> 00:43:17,160
something really fascinates you and but

1176
00:43:22,069 --> 00:43:18,900
there's no corroboration there's no

1177
00:43:24,470 --> 00:43:22,079
documentation you might ask other

1178
00:43:26,510 --> 00:43:24,480
sources the people that you know are on

1179
00:43:29,030 --> 00:43:26,520
the inside or other people out in the

1180
00:43:31,069 --> 00:43:29,040
UFO Community if they can verify it what

1181
00:43:32,930 --> 00:43:31,079
do they think try to gather other

1182
00:43:35,750 --> 00:43:32,940
people's opinions on it

1183
00:43:37,190 --> 00:43:35,760
but basically we're just stuck if we

1184
00:43:38,930 --> 00:43:37,200
can't like you know you might have a

1185
00:43:40,910 --> 00:43:38,940
fascinating like deathbed confession

1186
00:43:43,130 --> 00:43:40,920
from somebody for instance

1187
00:43:44,750 --> 00:43:43,140
who says they saw that the bodies at

1188
00:43:45,589 --> 00:43:44,760
Roswell and they did this and that and

1189
00:43:48,050 --> 00:43:45,599
that

1190
00:43:51,710 --> 00:43:48,060
it's just somebody's story unless you

1191
00:43:54,170 --> 00:43:51,720
have something to to back it up and um

1192
00:43:55,970 --> 00:43:54,180
therefore it doesn't it's not something

1193
00:43:59,150 --> 00:43:55,980
that the realm of Journalism can really

1194
00:44:02,329 --> 00:43:59,160
take on that's the problem right so you

1195
00:44:05,270 --> 00:44:02,339
have the UFO world that adheres to these

1196
00:44:07,069 --> 00:44:05,280
you know deathbed confessions and on the

1197
00:44:08,630 --> 00:44:07,079
journalistic side you can't you know

1198
00:44:10,250 --> 00:44:08,640
take it for what it is because there's

1199
00:44:12,170 --> 00:44:10,260
nothing to back it up

1200
00:44:14,510 --> 00:44:12,180
exactly we cannot go to the New York

1201
00:44:17,329 --> 00:44:14,520
Times and say hey this this anonymous

1202
00:44:19,730 --> 00:44:17,339
source over here just said this or even

1203
00:44:22,910 --> 00:44:19,740
if he's on the record you know he said

1204
00:44:25,370 --> 00:44:22,920
this it made this amazing claim but he's

1205
00:44:28,190 --> 00:44:25,380
one person telling a story no

1206
00:44:29,690 --> 00:44:28,200
documentation nobody else to say what

1207
00:44:33,050 --> 00:44:29,700
he's saying is true

1208
00:44:35,690 --> 00:44:33,060
I was there too I saw the same thing uh

1209
00:44:38,030 --> 00:44:35,700
you know anything like that it's just

1210
00:44:39,530 --> 00:44:38,040
it's just a story and that's not saying

1211
00:44:41,930 --> 00:44:39,540
that it isn't true

1212
00:44:44,510 --> 00:44:41,940
it doesn't mean that the the person

1213
00:44:46,190 --> 00:44:44,520
rejecting it like in myself because it's

1214
00:44:47,630 --> 00:44:46,200
my you know it's just the world I

1215
00:44:49,250 --> 00:44:47,640
operated and you there's certain

1216
00:44:51,829 --> 00:44:49,260
requirements you have to have to be a

1217
00:44:53,329 --> 00:44:51,839
journalist and it doesn't some it's not

1218
00:44:54,770 --> 00:44:53,339
about whether the story is true or not

1219
00:44:57,370 --> 00:44:54,780
it's about whether you have enough

1220
00:45:01,069 --> 00:44:57,380
documentation to at least put forward

1221
00:45:03,050 --> 00:45:01,079
you know the likelihood that it's true

1222
00:45:04,609 --> 00:45:03,060
um and so it's not like I'm saying I

1223
00:45:06,950 --> 00:45:04,619
don't believe these people

1224
00:45:09,530 --> 00:45:06,960
I just can't work with material like

1225
00:45:11,750 --> 00:45:09,540
that um so I think that for for people

1226
00:45:13,490 --> 00:45:11,760
you know who write blogs and so on if

1227
00:45:16,190 --> 00:45:13,500
you you know it's just something to look

1228
00:45:18,230 --> 00:45:16,200
out for to try to get documentation and

1229
00:45:20,089 --> 00:45:18,240
corroboration and ask other people who

1230
00:45:21,109 --> 00:45:20,099
might have some expertise about what

1231
00:45:23,150 --> 00:45:21,119
they think

1232
00:45:25,910 --> 00:45:23,160
and then you know if you want to get out

1233
00:45:28,849 --> 00:45:25,920
more I would suggest to people

1234
00:45:31,490 --> 00:45:28,859
trying to maybe write op-ed pieces for

1235
00:45:35,569 --> 00:45:31,500
your local like if you live in a town or

1236
00:45:37,490 --> 00:45:35,579
a small city that has a local newspaper

1237
00:45:39,710 --> 00:45:37,500
um you might be able to write like an uh

1238
00:45:42,290 --> 00:45:39,720
an opinion piece for that paper you know

1239
00:45:43,910 --> 00:45:42,300
if you if you're writing blogs anyway it

1240
00:45:46,190 --> 00:45:43,920
might not be that hard to turn it into

1241
00:45:47,750 --> 00:45:46,200
something that your newspaper would be

1242
00:45:49,910 --> 00:45:47,760
interested in and maybe you know if more

1243
00:45:52,490 --> 00:45:49,920
people did that it's sort of a way of

1244
00:45:54,650 --> 00:45:52,500
you know starting a Groundswell in all

1245
00:45:57,770 --> 00:45:54,660
these local communities because the

1246
00:45:59,870 --> 00:45:57,780
local newspapers are often more open to

1247
00:46:03,069 --> 00:45:59,880
that kind of thing although nowadays I

1248
00:46:05,450 --> 00:46:03,079
guess everything's online I don't know

1249
00:46:07,309 --> 00:46:05,460
it's just all online

1250
00:46:09,410 --> 00:46:07,319
so I don't know it's a different world

1251
00:46:10,970 --> 00:46:09,420
than when I was all through the you know

1252
00:46:13,250 --> 00:46:10,980
when I first got started all through the

1253
00:46:14,530 --> 00:46:13,260
2000s I was writing you know these op-ed

1254
00:46:16,609 --> 00:46:14,540
pieces for

1255
00:46:18,410 --> 00:46:16,619
newspapers that actually had were

1256
00:46:21,050 --> 00:46:18,420
physical newspapers and then there was

1257
00:46:23,210 --> 00:46:21,060
something called The Wire Services where

1258
00:46:24,770 --> 00:46:23,220
the newspaper would send it out on a

1259
00:46:26,990 --> 00:46:24,780
certain wire service so that it could be

1260
00:46:28,730 --> 00:46:27,000
picked up from by any other paper and my

1261
00:46:31,010 --> 00:46:28,740
stories were picked up all over the

1262
00:46:34,790 --> 00:46:31,020
place nowadays we just have the internet

1263
00:46:37,010 --> 00:46:34,800
so it's a different world but you know

1264
00:46:38,870 --> 00:46:37,020
so now I guess it's picked up all over

1265
00:46:41,089 --> 00:46:38,880
the Internet yeah but

1266
00:46:42,890 --> 00:46:41,099
in those days it was picked up by

1267
00:46:44,690 --> 00:46:42,900
reputable newspapers there was this

1268
00:46:46,490 --> 00:46:44,700
separate category and they were like

1269
00:46:48,589 --> 00:46:46,500
hard copies you know

1270
00:46:50,089 --> 00:46:48,599
I remember like when my stories were

1271
00:46:52,730 --> 00:46:50,099
picked up all over in these other papers

1272
00:46:55,670 --> 00:46:52,740
I try to find out which ones they were

1273
00:46:57,710 --> 00:46:55,680
and then I I go to that I'd go call them

1274
00:47:00,470 --> 00:46:57,720
up and they'd send me a hard copy and I

1275
00:47:03,170 --> 00:47:00,480
put in my files you know yeah yeah it

1276
00:47:04,190 --> 00:47:03,180
was contaminated or yeah well some of

1277
00:47:05,630 --> 00:47:04,200
them yeah some of them are really

1278
00:47:08,450 --> 00:47:05,640
special I've got some New York Times

1279
00:47:10,309 --> 00:47:08,460
stuff framed but I mean I just made sure

1280
00:47:12,470 --> 00:47:10,319
I wanted to get copies of them and they

1281
00:47:15,470 --> 00:47:12,480
the way to do that was to get the actual

1282
00:47:16,130 --> 00:47:15,480
hard copy you know and it's just

1283
00:47:19,250 --> 00:47:16,140
um

1284
00:47:21,050 --> 00:47:19,260
yeah so now I don't know how it works

1285
00:47:22,069 --> 00:47:21,060
now to write op-ed pieces but I I do

1286
00:47:23,470 --> 00:47:22,079
think that if people create

1287
00:47:26,510 --> 00:47:23,480
relationships with their local

1288
00:47:29,270 --> 00:47:26,520
newspapers that that might be an outlet

1289
00:47:30,770 --> 00:47:29,280
that's a great yeah we asked Ross Colter

1290
00:47:32,569 --> 00:47:30,780
too like what's it like being a

1291
00:47:34,069 --> 00:47:32,579
journalist and he says you know I get a

1292
00:47:35,930 --> 00:47:34,079
lot of hate mail from people that are

1293
00:47:37,490 --> 00:47:35,940
like where's your proof where's this

1294
00:47:39,770 --> 00:47:37,500
where's that and he's like I'm not a

1295
00:47:41,450 --> 00:47:39,780
scientist I don't owe the scientific

1296
00:47:44,089 --> 00:47:41,460
Community anything he said I'm a

1297
00:47:45,770 --> 00:47:44,099
journalist and many times journalists

1298
00:47:48,349 --> 00:47:45,780
because they're the first ones to report

1299
00:47:50,809 --> 00:47:48,359
on something maybe the information is a

1300
00:47:52,670 --> 00:47:50,819
little bit off or it needs to be

1301
00:47:54,530 --> 00:47:52,680
corrected at a later date and there's

1302
00:47:56,150 --> 00:47:54,540
mistakes made and he says but we have

1303
00:47:58,069 --> 00:47:56,160
that freedom to do that because we're

1304
00:48:00,170 --> 00:47:58,079
the front lines you know even like the

1305
00:48:01,790 --> 00:48:00,180
Gulf War and everything sometimes you

1306
00:48:03,230 --> 00:48:01,800
know the ticker would say one thing and

1307
00:48:05,270 --> 00:48:03,240
then it would quickly be corrected

1308
00:48:07,370 --> 00:48:05,280
because as information is coming in

1309
00:48:09,109 --> 00:48:07,380
you're forming this stuff and just

1310
00:48:11,930 --> 00:48:09,119
trying to grasp as much of it as you can

1311
00:48:13,790 --> 00:48:11,940
so I kind of like his attitude of I'm a

1312
00:48:15,770 --> 00:48:13,800
journalist I'm allowed to make a mistake

1313
00:48:17,930 --> 00:48:15,780
nobody knows about this leave me

1314
00:48:20,329 --> 00:48:17,940
alone not a scientist I don't owe you

1315
00:48:23,270 --> 00:48:20,339
that type of you know I'm not creating

1316
00:48:24,950 --> 00:48:23,280
work to submit for peer review so I

1317
00:48:26,390 --> 00:48:24,960
don't owe the world that because I'm not

1318
00:48:28,430 --> 00:48:26,400
saying that that's what I'm what I'm

1319
00:48:30,410 --> 00:48:28,440
doing that's not my mission my mission

1320
00:48:32,390 --> 00:48:30,420
is here's some interesting things to

1321
00:48:34,790 --> 00:48:32,400
ponder and I really like that

1322
00:48:36,230 --> 00:48:34,800
perspective of it in terms of you know

1323
00:48:37,849 --> 00:48:36,240
you're a little more because I think

1324
00:48:40,250 --> 00:48:37,859
you've been doing this so long and I

1325
00:48:42,109 --> 00:48:40,260
think you're used to what can happen if

1326
00:48:43,790 --> 00:48:42,119
you don't have your facts straight that

1327
00:48:45,530 --> 00:48:43,800
you just come correct now and if you

1328
00:48:48,290 --> 00:48:45,540
can't get the information you're going

1329
00:48:50,150 --> 00:48:48,300
to need you don't touch it but um I

1330
00:48:52,790 --> 00:48:50,160
think that maybe that comes from a

1331
00:48:54,290 --> 00:48:52,800
different time or from you know things

1332
00:48:56,089 --> 00:48:54,300
are just changing now and people are

1333
00:48:58,490 --> 00:48:56,099
very quick to jump down your throat so

1334
00:49:01,490 --> 00:48:58,500
it's good to Define what your mission is

1335
00:49:03,589 --> 00:49:01,500
right yeah and I think Ross has access

1336
00:49:05,930 --> 00:49:03,599
to media that gives him a lot more

1337
00:49:08,870 --> 00:49:05,940
leeway when he writes he does a show for

1338
00:49:10,730 --> 00:49:08,880
channel 7 in Australia he has a lot more

1339
00:49:13,550 --> 00:49:10,740
leeway than we have at the New York

1340
00:49:15,950 --> 00:49:13,560
Times in terms what he can report so

1341
00:49:17,870 --> 00:49:15,960
there's a huge difference there as long

1342
00:49:19,670 --> 00:49:17,880
long as you know Ralph and I are

1343
00:49:22,609 --> 00:49:19,680
sticking with the New York Times which

1344
00:49:25,790 --> 00:49:22,619
we are for now because we know the

1345
00:49:28,250 --> 00:49:25,800
impact it can have it restricts what we

1346
00:49:30,230 --> 00:49:28,260
can do and how much of it we can do

1347
00:49:32,270 --> 00:49:30,240
in a way that Ross doesn't really have

1348
00:49:34,490 --> 00:49:32,280
to deal with as much because he has a

1349
00:49:36,290 --> 00:49:34,500
station behind him that that allows it

1350
00:49:38,150 --> 00:49:36,300
sort of be more expansive so that's part

1351
00:49:39,650 --> 00:49:38,160
of the difference too and he's going to

1352
00:49:41,630 --> 00:49:39,660
probably get more of that kind of hate

1353
00:49:44,089 --> 00:49:41,640
mail than than Ralph and I are going to

1354
00:49:46,970 --> 00:49:44,099
get because you know we are we're so

1355
00:49:49,609 --> 00:49:46,980
vetted by the times yeah everything is

1356
00:49:52,730 --> 00:49:49,619
every single sentence has to be you know

1357
00:49:54,890 --> 00:49:52,740
absolutely checked out and backed up and

1358
00:49:56,569 --> 00:49:54,900
verified and everything else so there

1359
00:49:58,430 --> 00:49:56,579
really isn't I mean there have been some

1360
00:50:00,550 --> 00:49:58,440
errors in our stories and they've been

1361
00:50:02,930 --> 00:50:00,560
corrected or

1362
00:50:04,849 --> 00:50:02,940
one thing that Harry Reid wanted to have

1363
00:50:06,650 --> 00:50:04,859
changed I I don't think it was an error

1364
00:50:08,990 --> 00:50:06,660
but he wanted us to change it so we did

1365
00:50:11,630 --> 00:50:09,000
you know things like that but

1366
00:50:14,210 --> 00:50:11,640
Ralph um Ross is able to take a lot more

1367
00:50:16,910 --> 00:50:14,220
risk I guess is my point in what he says

1368
00:50:19,130 --> 00:50:16,920
than we are because he's working for

1369
00:50:22,069 --> 00:50:19,140
different kind of media than we yeah

1370
00:50:24,710 --> 00:50:22,079
a little bit more Loser on the on the

1371
00:50:27,230 --> 00:50:24,720
way that they do things right so yeah or

1372
00:50:29,150 --> 00:50:27,240
just has you know a broader yeah more

1373
00:50:30,950 --> 00:50:29,160
you know less rigorous kind of

1374
00:50:34,130 --> 00:50:30,960
controlling

1375
00:50:36,829 --> 00:50:34,140
uh approach than the name of times does

1376
00:50:39,770 --> 00:50:36,839
a big difference yeah it's not it's not

1377
00:50:41,210 --> 00:50:39,780
any less it's just different yeah you

1378
00:50:44,089 --> 00:50:41,220
know the advantage is it gives them the

1379
00:50:46,790 --> 00:50:44,099
ability to bring a lot more out than we

1380
00:50:48,890 --> 00:50:46,800
can do and you know a lot of really

1381
00:50:49,970 --> 00:50:48,900
interesting stuff that he brings out all

1382
00:50:51,589 --> 00:50:49,980
the time

1383
00:50:54,950 --> 00:50:51,599
so I'm really glad he's out there doing

1384
00:50:56,870 --> 00:50:54,960
that yeah and you're I could see you

1385
00:50:58,190 --> 00:50:56,880
know from the back to back he's got a

1386
00:51:01,130 --> 00:50:58,200
lot more of a

1387
00:51:03,770 --> 00:51:01,140
I can say this you know he can just

1388
00:51:05,450 --> 00:51:03,780
bluntly say like on his UFO or not UFO

1389
00:51:08,089 --> 00:51:05,460
UFO Twitter rant

1390
00:51:09,650 --> 00:51:08,099
um that he had which we I loved it uh

1391
00:51:11,030 --> 00:51:09,660
like you could tell he's just now at the

1392
00:51:12,589 --> 00:51:11,040
point where he just telling he's

1393
00:51:14,450 --> 00:51:12,599
shooting his street which is which is

1394
00:51:16,130 --> 00:51:14,460
awesome to see right give me permission

1395
00:51:18,530 --> 00:51:16,140
to say whatever he wanted we said listen

1396
00:51:20,089 --> 00:51:18,540
Ross if you want to clarify something or

1397
00:51:24,370 --> 00:51:20,099
get something off your chest you go

1398
00:51:29,569 --> 00:51:27,829
it was force he did Leslie what's coming

1399
00:51:31,250 --> 00:51:29,579
up on December 3rd there's a conference

1400
00:51:32,750 --> 00:51:31,260
that you're attending

1401
00:51:34,670 --> 00:51:32,760
want to talk a little bit about that

1402
00:51:37,010 --> 00:51:34,680
yeah this is a very cool thing I think

1403
00:51:39,589 --> 00:51:37,020
well this is a conferences organized by

1404
00:51:41,750 --> 00:51:39,599
the experiencer group which is kind of

1405
00:51:43,069 --> 00:51:41,760
like a support group for experiencers I

1406
00:51:44,809 --> 00:51:43,079
don't know how else to describe but a

1407
00:51:48,109 --> 00:51:44,819
wonderful wonderful group and they they

1408
00:51:50,510 --> 00:51:48,119
did a conference last Saturday I guess

1409
00:51:53,390 --> 00:51:50,520
it was uh today's Sunday so last weekend

1410
00:51:55,609 --> 00:51:53,400
October 8th in New York which was their

1411
00:51:58,250 --> 00:51:55,619
first one and it's basically organized

1412
00:52:00,770 --> 00:51:58,260
by Jay King and James iandoli who were

1413
00:52:02,030 --> 00:52:00,780
both members of the experiencer group

1414
00:52:04,190 --> 00:52:02,040
um and so I'm sort of helping them

1415
00:52:06,829 --> 00:52:04,200
organize the next one a little bit

1416
00:52:09,049 --> 00:52:06,839
um and the last one was so successful

1417
00:52:10,670 --> 00:52:09,059
they got such great and I was there and

1418
00:52:12,650 --> 00:52:10,680
I thought it was fantastic they got

1419
00:52:14,510 --> 00:52:12,660
great feedback

1420
00:52:16,609 --> 00:52:14,520
um and Gary Nolan was was there which

1421
00:52:19,010 --> 00:52:16,619
was amazing he did like a one hour q a

1422
00:52:20,930 --> 00:52:19,020
it has a live audience but then it's

1423
00:52:23,809 --> 00:52:20,940
also live streamed so they're doing

1424
00:52:26,210 --> 00:52:23,819
another one on December 3rd

1425
00:52:27,650 --> 00:52:26,220
um and also in New York which is so

1426
00:52:29,210 --> 00:52:27,660
great because most conferences don't

1427
00:52:30,530 --> 00:52:29,220
take place on the East Coast but there

1428
00:52:33,170 --> 00:52:30,540
were people that came to this one from

1429
00:52:36,890 --> 00:52:33,180
all over people flew in from California

1430
00:52:38,030 --> 00:52:36,900
Chicago even the UK it was amazing all

1431
00:52:41,630 --> 00:52:38,040
over the place

1432
00:52:43,730 --> 00:52:41,640
so so far they have um myself and Ralph

1433
00:52:45,349 --> 00:52:43,740
Blumenthal are both going to be there

1434
00:52:47,510 --> 00:52:45,359
um and it'll be interesting for us to be

1435
00:52:50,870 --> 00:52:47,520
be able to be together you know because

1436
00:52:53,870 --> 00:52:50,880
we don't do that very often and

1437
00:52:57,049 --> 00:52:53,880
um uh Jeff kreypel from Rice University

1438
00:52:58,010 --> 00:52:57,059
who's just absolutely an incredible

1439
00:53:00,589 --> 00:52:58,020
speaker

1440
00:53:02,990 --> 00:53:00,599
and writer and expert on anomalous

1441
00:53:05,569 --> 00:53:03,000
experiences and

1442
00:53:07,190 --> 00:53:05,579
um a woman named Sharon roulette who's a

1443
00:53:09,410 --> 00:53:07,200
philosopher kind of

1444
00:53:11,809 --> 00:53:09,420
um she's written in a book on

1445
00:53:13,849 --> 00:53:11,819
coincidence and synchronicity

1446
00:53:15,410 --> 00:53:13,859
I guess she's a philosopher by training

1447
00:53:17,150 --> 00:53:15,420
I don't you know she's in the academic

1448
00:53:18,290 --> 00:53:17,160
world she's a professor she's been a

1449
00:53:20,569 --> 00:53:18,300
professor she's I think she's now

1450
00:53:21,950 --> 00:53:20,579
independent but she's also on the board

1451
00:53:23,750 --> 00:53:21,960
of the Bigelow Institute for

1452
00:53:26,210 --> 00:53:23,760
Consciousness studies which I was on the

1453
00:53:27,950 --> 00:53:26,220
board of previously

1454
00:53:29,690 --> 00:53:27,960
um anyway this book that she's written

1455
00:53:31,069 --> 00:53:29,700
on coincidence and synchronicities is

1456
00:53:33,470 --> 00:53:31,079
really amazing so she's going to talk

1457
00:53:35,930 --> 00:53:33,480
about that and then Whitley strebel will

1458
00:53:38,630 --> 00:53:35,940
be there as well doing his thing

1459
00:53:40,730 --> 00:53:38,640
and then there's one other incredible

1460
00:53:42,049 --> 00:53:40,740
guest incredible speaker who I'm not

1461
00:53:43,370 --> 00:53:42,059
allowed to tell you yeah who it is

1462
00:53:44,690 --> 00:53:43,380
because they're going to announce it at

1463
00:53:47,270 --> 00:53:44,700
the end of the I think this coming week

1464
00:53:49,069 --> 00:53:47,280
they will announce it but okay

1465
00:53:50,329 --> 00:53:49,079
um I it it's going to be really

1466
00:53:52,130 --> 00:53:50,339
interesting to have this person there

1467
00:53:54,170 --> 00:53:52,140
too so

1468
00:53:55,730 --> 00:53:54,180
um yeah I'm looking forward to it I

1469
00:53:59,030 --> 00:53:55,740
think it's going to be a fantastic

1470
00:54:02,270 --> 00:53:59,040
Gathering of people and speakers running

1471
00:54:04,150 --> 00:54:02,280
gamut from the the weird you know the

1472
00:54:08,150 --> 00:54:04,160
world of Whitley strieber

1473
00:54:10,370 --> 00:54:08,160
to the more hardcore stuff which I do

1474
00:54:12,349 --> 00:54:10,380
and which our other guest does as well

1475
00:54:13,970 --> 00:54:12,359
who I'm not allowed to name so it's

1476
00:54:17,210 --> 00:54:13,980
going to kind of cover this this whole

1477
00:54:20,450 --> 00:54:17,220
universe from different approaches

1478
00:54:23,030 --> 00:54:20,460
of of you know experience and the nature

1479
00:54:24,530 --> 00:54:23,040
of the phenomenon itself so and what's

1480
00:54:26,690 --> 00:54:24,540
happening in Washington and all of that

1481
00:54:28,670 --> 00:54:26,700
it's all going to be included you know

1482
00:54:32,870 --> 00:54:28,680
you're you're speaking as well Leslie

1483
00:54:34,250 --> 00:54:32,880
yeah okay nice yeah yep Louie do you

1484
00:54:36,170 --> 00:54:34,260
have any final questions for our guests

1485
00:54:37,730 --> 00:54:36,180
today no I don't I just want to uh I

1486
00:54:40,190 --> 00:54:37,740
want to extend a very warm thanks to

1487
00:54:41,690 --> 00:54:40,200
Leslie Kane for uh giving us an hour of

1488
00:54:43,910 --> 00:54:41,700
your time I know you're a very busy

1489
00:54:46,010 --> 00:54:43,920
person uh you probably have paid gigs

1490
00:54:49,010 --> 00:54:46,020
this wasn't one of them and nor for us

1491
00:54:51,589 --> 00:54:49,020
but uh we do this uh out of a genuine

1492
00:54:53,150 --> 00:54:51,599
curiosity and an interest we were saying

1493
00:54:55,370 --> 00:54:53,160
before the show this is our virtual

1494
00:54:56,990 --> 00:54:55,380
living room and we like having these

1495
00:55:00,470 --> 00:54:57,000
conversations with thousands of people

1496
00:55:02,390 --> 00:55:00,480
watching and just cool bright people to

1497
00:55:03,589 --> 00:55:02,400
give us their perspective and uh we

1498
00:55:05,930 --> 00:55:03,599
really thank you for coming on the show

1499
00:55:07,490 --> 00:55:05,940
we'd love to have you again sometime and

1500
00:55:08,990 --> 00:55:07,500
uh where could people follow you before

1501
00:55:10,790 --> 00:55:09,000
we close

1502
00:55:12,829 --> 00:55:10,800
I know because I'm not in this Twitter

1503
00:55:15,410 --> 00:55:12,839
universe exactly where do they find you

1504
00:55:17,990 --> 00:55:15,420
follow you well I have a Facebook page

1505
00:55:20,930 --> 00:55:18,000
so I'm back in the in the archaic world

1506
00:55:22,370 --> 00:55:20,940
of Facebook and um I you know that's

1507
00:55:23,809 --> 00:55:22,380
probably the best place and I have a

1508
00:55:26,809 --> 00:55:23,819
website which just which is just my

1509
00:55:30,349 --> 00:55:26,819
name.com Leslie kane.com last name

1510
00:55:32,690 --> 00:55:30,359
spelled k-e-a-n but um my author

1511
00:55:35,390 --> 00:55:32,700
Facebook page is kind of where most of

1512
00:55:38,150 --> 00:55:35,400
my stuff happens and I I apologize that

1513
00:55:40,490 --> 00:55:38,160
I'm not on it more

1514
00:55:42,049 --> 00:55:40,500
um you know sometimes I'm just got too

1515
00:55:43,970 --> 00:55:42,059
many things going on and I'm not on it

1516
00:55:45,829 --> 00:55:43,980
all that much but what I like about my

1517
00:55:48,589 --> 00:55:45,839
Facebook page is that we really do get

1518
00:55:50,930 --> 00:55:48,599
into discussions and comments there that

1519
00:55:52,970 --> 00:55:50,940
I feel are very solid and thoughtful and

1520
00:55:56,170 --> 00:55:52,980
people can write longer comments whereas

1521
00:56:02,150 --> 00:55:58,790
people just throw in these sort of quick

1522
00:56:03,650 --> 00:56:02,160
little things and so I feel like I like

1523
00:56:06,890 --> 00:56:03,660
to stay on Facebook because it's more

1524
00:56:08,809 --> 00:56:06,900
it's thoughtful in that way and um I

1525
00:56:11,750 --> 00:56:08,819
think I guess Instagram is even worse

1526
00:56:15,109 --> 00:56:11,760
than Twitter I don't know I just I'm

1527
00:56:17,390 --> 00:56:15,119
like I just um not into the whole social

1528
00:56:19,910 --> 00:56:17,400
media thing very much but I do I do do

1529
00:56:22,130 --> 00:56:19,920
the Facebook thing so I hope people will

1530
00:56:23,630 --> 00:56:22,140
will come on and as soon as we have the

1531
00:56:24,950 --> 00:56:23,640
announcement about the conference as

1532
00:56:27,470 --> 00:56:24,960
soon as they have it

1533
00:56:29,510 --> 00:56:27,480
I will post it on my Facebook page and

1534
00:56:31,609 --> 00:56:29,520
everyone won't find out about it so

1535
00:56:33,470 --> 00:56:31,619
we'll make sure to re-share it and post

1536
00:56:36,410 --> 00:56:33,480
it as well for sure hope you guys for

1537
00:56:38,450 --> 00:56:36,420
having me on it was the time flew by and

1538
00:56:40,910 --> 00:56:38,460
I think you're doing a great podcast I

1539
00:56:43,309 --> 00:56:40,920
really appreciate it and I hope more

1540
00:56:46,190 --> 00:56:43,319
people in Canada will start listening

1541
00:56:47,750 --> 00:56:46,200
yeah I says well thank you so much for

1542
00:56:55,000 --> 00:56:47,760
coming on the show today we appreciate

1543
00:57:04,970 --> 00:57:03,130
[Music]